PKM. Other thoughts

[Human_001]

The Пулемёт Калашникова Модернизированный, seems to have almost no strong recoil that prevent it from being fired from unstable postion.

YouTube - PKM machine gun
YouTube - Firing PK Machine Gun Kneeling

I don't personally suggest to fix the PKM in paticular.

With 0.8 release I felt my definition of combat reality and things I expected from this modification is different in nature from this modifications goal.

Although, there is no doubt that this modification is among the best available for BF2 with its high quality mapping, effects, and animations.

Thank you for reading. I Will continue to stay active forum member.

[Drav]

So what are you saying? More or less recoil?

Looking at those videos the recoil looks brutal compared to a minimi.....

[Human_001]

Less recoil.

No I don't see any brutal recoil in any of those. To me it looks very stable with fullauto or burst while standing.

[Sadist_Cain]

it's just right, the guy who's standing isn't aiming at bugger all so his hand can stablise a lot easier, he still wont hit shizzle

The kneeling guy is experiencing quite a lot of recoil, remember to go off by about a centimeter that's going to throw you off by miles at a target that's 100m away

7.62 rounds are BIIG bullets and they do give a lotta kick, however the PKM still remains my favorite auto rifle purely because you hit one of those round on a target and they know it

I invite you to look at a soldier firing the PKM
YouTube - PKM Machine Gun

bigass amounts of kick in that gun, keep as is

[Drav]

Exactly. Human, compare the PKM with the SAW:

YouTube - shooting the m249 para saw

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=rt4KnbkqsMY&NR=1


Now THATs no recoil!!

[Caboosehatesbabies]

Ha, look at this! Not saying it should be in game, but funny.

YouTube - Dual Weilding M249 Machine Guns

[DkMick]

So what are you saying? More or less recoil?

Looking at those videos the recoil looks brutal compared to a minimi.....

Agreed.

[Human_001]

Well... The recoil seems to be alot different when fired by different person. I know a person can shoot 9mm handgun like as if its .22LR while some other person shoot it and it looks like firing .44 mag.
For example,
YouTube - AK47 with and without hammer retarder
At 1:48 is the AK. Its obvious from way he holds the gun, and with wrong information provided in this video, this person is certainly amateur.
YouTube - Assault Rifles - G3, M16, AK47

They hold gun in same way. Only difference I see is one with alot more recoil don't have bipod. Just out of curiosity, I wonder how much those bipod weights.
YouTube - PKM Machine Gun
YouTube - Firing PK Machine Gun Kneeling
Found another video.
YouTube - PKM Machine Gun 7.62

Still, I think current version is made in such that its Impossible to control. Even if some one is good at controlling recoil in game as much as the guy in first video.

[Fluffywuffy]

Recoil is hard but the gun weighs a lot so it drops?

[Sadist_Cain]

Dude those videos are showing a LOT of recoil

Check out the one where you can see the dust flying, you see in the first burst about 3 patchs of dust go up then everything else is hitting the sky

[Teek]

Dude those videos are showing a LOT of recoil

Check out the one where you can see the dust flying, you see in the first burst about 3 patchs of dust go up then everything else is hitting the sky

true dat, He hit 5 time out of 40 shots.

[MoonDawg]

Having fired over 20.000 rounds with a MG-3 (7.62 nato), I can safely say that a MG is not something you fire standing with any hope of accuracy.
Lying down however is a whole different thing.

These guns are not designed for snap shots, they are designed to be deployed for squad support/supressive fire.

I once fired an entire 200 belt continously from the hip.
The force was so immense, I took two steps back before I managed to
control it. And I certainly could not aim.

the MG3 is a heavy weapon, which makes it awkward to fire from the shoulder.

The way MG's are represented now in PR is by far the best I've seen in any game. If only the toon didnt check to see if the belt is in everytime he folds in the bipod, I'd be the happiest gunner

[nedlands1]

Having fired over 20.000 rounds with a MG-3 (7.62 nato), I can safely say that a MG is not something you fire standing with any hope of accuracy.
Lying down however is a whole different thing.

I'd be interested to hear what sort of accuracy you could expect when in a prone supported position with an MG3. Current the handheld MG's shoot 1m groups at 80m with short bursts (~6 rounds). Would you say that combat stress would have much of an impact on the group size?

[MoonDawg]

Out of those 20000, not a single one was fired in combat. Luckily

I regularly fired at 200m, and squeezing off singleshots, could take down 5 30X30cm targets in less than 5 seconds.
a "burst" of 4-6 rds would be located within a half-torso target (50cm width?)

So 1m spread@80 is not too precise. But range is weird ingame, and combat stress an unknown quantity.
The MG's FEEL correct now, teaming up with a spotter makes for an effective fire support, as it should be. MG's are an important squad asset.

[job86]

When can we do this in PR? YouTube - Dual Weilding M249 Machine Guns

[Sabre_tooth_tigger]

Not unless you want them to up the deviation to the side of an aircraft carrier


5.56mm is junk so here is A M4 rifle that fires 50 cal - YouTube - 50 Beowulf - Future Weapons


50 cal full size machinegun fired while walking round - YouTube - KORD 12,7 mm machine gun(Shooting a machine gun, standing)




sword stops bullets - YouTube - Japanese Sword Versus a Bullet.

I recommend all these things be put into a mod but not pr


Check out this 50 cal round going right through a tree though

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3weGexBGg0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VHlhLdvJ8a8

[Spaz]

Having fired over 20.000 rounds with a MG-3 (7.62 nato), I can safely say that a MG is not something you fire standing with any hope of accuracy.

Last time I checked the MG3 fired a lot faster then the PKM, that should make a big difference in recoil.

[donovancs1]

The way i see it is the only way you will hit a target is if you lay on a roof or hill ABOVE your enemy,you will have more cover and will be able to see your enemy better than shooting from a flat area,because when you lay in a flat area you need time to look up,plus if there is something in front of you you lose your visual.

[MoonDawg]

Yes, MG's ~1200 rpm vs PKM's 650. And the HK21 is at 900.


However the weight and design of HK21 and PKM would make it impractical to fire from the shoulder.
You'd experience better result firing from the hip.
I guess the Minimi's would be as lambs compared to the 7.62's and I have seen them fired from the shoulder.

I would love to see the HK21 replaced with MG3 though