Helicopters are too unrealistic

[gazzthompson]

How's this for proof? Thought it'd be useless to put my face on it cuz it could be anybody's face so I decided to enter my name

thats good proof

[Robert1983nl]

Got any pics of you flying your chinook and can you prove its you?

Hundreds of 'm, also videos. But I actually decided to take a new photo for you today. It's 2 posts up, you probably already saw it.

Otherwise my suggestion to you is go play vBF2 and dont complain about PR's choppers unless your criticisms are going to be constructive.

I really like the concept of PR, but the helicopters are just awful and it bugs me. That's why I started this thread with constructive criticism. I pointed out a lot of things that are wrong with handling. And now, even 8 pages further, still no one comes with a solution other than "code it yourself". So I decided to check out BF2 again, to see how those helicopters fly, and it's just about 3x more realistic than in PR.
And yeah, maybe the Blackhawk is a little slow in BF2. It should go around 350 on the HUD. In PR, it goes way too fast. Helicopters aren't fast. They really do move too fast in PR. Just check out Youtube for some cockpit videos.

I think you are having a problem understanding the meaning of constructive criticism so let me quote the definition of it for you.

I think you should read my first post in this thread.

The only suggestion you have is for us to revert to vBF2 which is not going to happen.

Ok... Then you'll keep the helicopters very unrealistic on purpose. You really shouldn't call this mod Project 'Reality' then.

you are also saying that vbf2 choppers are the correct speed but the Chinook is a very fast chopper at top speeds, yes the acceleration in PR is not perfect, we know this, very hard to get acceleration just right, but the top speed is more or less correct.

As stated before, top speed is way too high. 350-370 on the HUD would be a good speed. Not doing 800+ in a helicopter which sometimes happens in PR. And the top speeds that helicopters fly aren't all that much different from eachother. It'll be a difference of around 20, or 30 knots tops in reality.

Again, if you really want to help PR, help code the choppers correctly rather than just saying our choppers are "a big joke"?

Thanks again.

I'm helping by saying: Go back to the BF2 handling. It's 3 times more realistic.

[bosco_]

As said before, the BF2 HUD speed is bullshit... 1 bf2 speed unit = 0.375 km/h

So for example 800 bf2 units = 300 km/h

[waldo_ii]

BF2's speed measurement, while inaccurate, was designed to be easy.

If you maintain a consistent speed of X, then you will travel X meters in 10 seconds.

If you are flying at a speed of 1000, you will travel 1000 meters in ten seconds.

[Drav]

How's this for proof? Thought it'd be useless to put my face on it cuz it could be anybody's face so I decided to enter my name

Yep, good enough for me!!

[Robert1983nl]

As said before, the BF2 HUD speed is bullshit... 1 bf2 speed unit = 0.375 km/h

So for example 800 bf2 units = 300 km/h

People really have a freaking hard time understanding what I'm saying. This time, I didn't say it is 350kmph or knots or whatever. Just saying that 800 on THE HUD is WAY too fast, and 350-370 ON THE HUD is a more realistic speed. Damnnn... sometimes you have to explain EVERYTHING to people.

[hx.bjoffe]

That looks like an expensive telephone you got there Robert
So you'd prefer it had a top speed of 130 km/h, as long as it says 350? I think the current solution is slightly better... You can't have the cake and shove it down similtanious, you know.

[Hitperson]

People really have a freaking hard time understanding what I'm saying. This time, I didn't say it is 350kmph or knots or whatever. Just saying that 800 on THE HUD is WAY too fast, and 350-370 ON THE HUD is a more realistic speed. Damnnn... sometimes you have to explain EVERYTHING to people.

they can't change that though as it uses the BF2 standard measurement for distance.

[Rhino]

your first post is a little better but for a coder it really doesn't give anything to work with, that's to say if we had any coders available to work on this which we dont, our only coders we have right now are working on much bigger things.

If you really dont want to get into coding, but take it from me tweaking chopper physics is all in all, just number crunching and trial and error for the most part, it just takes a hell of a lot of time so unless you are going to do this yourself or work with some one from the community who is a coder (got a few a bout) who may be willing to work with you, I dont see them getting changed drastically any time soon.

Just try changing the physics on a chopper a bit, playing around with it you may find you get some where with it.

[Robert1983nl]

That looks like an expensive telephone you got there Robert
So you'd prefer it had a top speed of 130 km/h, as long as it says 350? I think the current solution is slightly better... You can't have the cake and shove it down similtanious, you know.

No... Damn I even have to explain it more. I'm just saying that 350-370 on the HUD probably compares with around 140-150 knots in real life.

700-800 ON THE HUD is way too fast. A helicopter would stall long before that speed is reached in reality.

[Robert1983nl]

your first post is a little better but for a coder it really doesn't give anything to work with, that's to say if we had any coders available to work on this which we dont, our only coders we have right now are working on much bigger things.

That's why I said look at BF2. That's a very good example of how the helicopters should handle. Maybe tweak it a little so they go just a little bit faster. But other than that, it's way better than the helicopters right now in PR. You get more accurate speed, more accurate acceleration, more accurate inertia and more accurate slope landings/takeoffs in BF2.
The only reason it's harder to fly helicopters in PR is because the way they fly is not logical as it defies all laws of physics and therefor is totally unpredictable and hard to get a feeling for. Instead of being able to use common sense flying helicopters in PR, you have to realize it's totally unrealistic and work your way from there to learn to fly them like it's some cheap underdeveloped arcade game.

[Robert1983nl]

That looks like an expensive telephone you got there Robert
So you'd prefer it had a top speed of 130 km/h, as long as it says 350? I think the current solution is slightly better... You can't have the cake and shove it down similtanious, you know.

Yeah the phone is actually in the top left corner of the photo. It's a satellite phone so yeah, it's pretty expensive

[Rhino]

you can't just add "more power" to vbf2 choppers, doing that would make them spaz out. Every setting has a effect on basically everything of the chopper, all the settings need to be tweaked to work together in harmony.

For exsample the most likly thing would happen if you only added more power to the chopper engine is it would just turn in 1/2 a sec etc and would be able to do loop after loop after loop which is hardly realistic

Like I said, we have no one to work on these right now, and your the best person for the job with time if you are a pilot etc, its very much trial and error until you get what you want so if you want these to change, please do them otherwise its not going to happen any time soon and when they do get tweaked they will probably not be anything like your expectations.

[Cp]

No... Damn I even have to explain it more. I'm just saying that 350-370 on the HUD probably compares with around 140-150 knots in real life.

actually 370 "on the HUD" would be 74.5 knots in reality.
An R22 Robinson has a faster cruise speed than that.

[hx.bjoffe]

700-800 ON THE HUD is way too fast. A helicopter would stall long before that speed is reached in reality.

Or is it you that need more explaining? Screw what the HUD says, it's not realistic no, but one can use it still to measure speed.
Realistic speed or realistic speedometer. Dont you see that the one excludes the other? Don't you agree the speedometer has a little less priority in the big picture?

[Waaah_Wah]

Or is it you that need more explaining? Screw what the HUD says, it's not realistic no, but one can use it still to measure speed.
Realistic speed or realistic speedometer. Dont you see that the one excludes the other? Don't you agree the speedometer has a little less priority in the big picture?

What i think he ment was that when the speed is 800 on the HUD, the chopter is moving too fast compared to real life. But when the HUD shows 300, the speed is more realistic.

Btw, can someone drag some of these military advisors in this thread? Would be interesting to see what they have to say.


PS: Rhino ffs, stop trying to get this guy to code something. Hes clearly not interested.

[Waaah_Wah]

That's why I said look at BF2. That's a very good example of how the helicopters should handle. Maybe tweak it a little so they go just a little bit faster. But other than that, it's way better than the helicopters right now in PR. You get more accurate speed, more accurate acceleration, more accurate inertia and more accurate slope landings/takeoffs in BF2.
The only reason it's harder to fly helicopters in PR is because the way they fly is not logical as it defies all laws of physics and therefor is totally unpredictable and hard to get a feeling for. Instead of being able to use common sense flying helicopters in PR, you have to realize it's totally unrealistic and work your way from there to learn to fly them like it's some cheap underdeveloped arcade game.

Hm... What helicopters have you tried in PR?

[Rhino]

wow, a post from waaah wah thats more than 1 line

PS: Rhino ffs, stop trying to get this guy to code something. Hes clearly not interested.

I'm not telling him to code, I'm suggesting that he codes it cos if this is what he wants, the only way its going to get done the way he wants it is if dose it himself, do you think if I sat back and watched muttrah would have been crated, even if I posted up suggestions and even detailed plans of it? highly unlikely and if so, it would have never been made in the same way I envisioned it.

[Waaah_Wah]

wow, a post from waaah wah thats more than 1 line

I know, i was amaized myself

I'm not telling him to code, I'm suggesting that he codes it cos if this is what he wants, the only way its going to get done the way he wants it is if dose it himself, do you think if I sat back and watched muttrah would have been crated, even if I posted up suggestions and even detailed plans of it? highly unlikely and if so, it would have never been made in the same way I envisioned it.

Yes, but there is a difference between giving feedback and being a DEV If this guy is actually a helichopter pilot you might want to listen to him.


Anyways, lets not derail this thread