CQB/Urban Sniper

[gclark03]

CQB snipers are equal to scoped riflemen.

Marksmen are long-range scoped riflemen.

Snipers are long-range marksmen with a different purpose.

[Solid Knight]

Ramiel and Muttrah, you want to duplicate a kit for two maps? You want to remodel the kit geo, model the weapon and get new animations for two fething maps?

I guess with an attitude like that we should have just kept the vBF2 M4. Regardless, in urban scenarios they could just use any of the existing soldier geometries and give him a new gun. Geometries are already being revamped anyway.

Secondly, the DMR wouldn't be the same rifle. They may both be semi-auto but that doesn't make them the same. The sniper has greater magnification and is much more accurate. Furthermore the sniper is the only one that uses the breathing mechanic in PR.

Me thinks you're using the DMR class improperly. He's not a sniper.

[Tirak]

I guess with an attitude like that we should have just kept the vBF2 M4. Regardless, in urban scenarios they could just use any of the existing soldier geometries and give him a new gun. Geometries are already being revamped anyway.

Secondly, the DMR wouldn't be the same rifle. They may both be semi-auto but that doesn't make them the same. The sniper has greater magnification and is much more accurate. Furthermore the sniper is the only one that uses the breathing mechanic in PR.

Me thinks you're using the DMR class improperly. He's not a sniper.

I don't use the DMR anymore, but like I said, it's about mentality, not kit. Sure, the Sniper Kit has more magnification, but anything you're engaging at ranges that need the full magnification are not anything you're going to be able to engage rapidly and accurately, and no, it is not much more accurate, at the ranges we're talking about where the sniper is providing rapid and accurate fire the Marksman rifle is more than sufficient. As for breathing mechanic, several of the Marksman rifles have fully automatic modes, making them incompatible with the sound file as hitting the primary weapon button would switch firing modes. Besides, it's only a sound file, count it off in your head.

[Solid Knight]

I don't use the DMR anymore, but like I said, it's about mentality, not kit. Sure, the Sniper Kit has more magnification, but anything you're engaging at ranges that need the full magnification are not anything you're going to be able to engage rapidly and accurately, and no, it is not much more accurate, at the ranges we're talking about where the sniper is providing rapid and accurate fire the Marksman rifle is more than sufficient. As for breathing mechanic, several of the Marksman rifles have fully automatic modes, making them incompatible with the sound file as hitting the primary weapon button would switch firing modes. Besides, it's only a sound file, count it off in your head.

Magnification helps in an ubran environment where it is likely that your enemy is only partially exposed. And again the DMR is not nearly as accurate as the sniper rifle. Not even close. It uses the same deviation as every other rifle in the game. It has a scope. That's it.

The reason for semi-auto isn't for wiping out entire squads 1,000 meters out. It's because inevitably the enemy will get in close and you will need that rapid fire. It's so you can deal with threats that are in range to shoot back better whilst still performing your function. That is the purpose. It's pretty damn simple.

[Tirak]

Magnification helps in an ubran environment where it is likely that your enemy is only partially exposed. And again the DMR is not nearly as accurate as the sniper rifle. Not even close. It uses the same deviation as every other rifle in the game. It has a scope. That's it.

The reason for semi-auto isn't for wiping out entire squads 1,000 meters out. It's because inevitably the enemy will get in close and you will need that rapid fire. It's so you can deal with threats that are in range to shoot back better whilst still performing your function. That is the purpose. It's pretty damn simple.

High magnification plus short range equals body bag. You want a kit that can easily take out people at 1km out while still having the rate of fire and ability to kill someone up close and personal. Seems like you're looking for teh 1337 snipz0rz kit.

[Solid Knight]

High magnification plus short range equals body bag. You want a kit that can easily take out people at 1km out while still having the rate of fire and ability to kill someone up close and personal. Seems like you're looking for teh 1337 snipz0rz kit.

The sniper kit has variable levels of magnification. You can have one that is more suited to medium range engagements (and OMFG they already do). By 'close' I meant sub 200 meter ranges. Below 200 meter any punk with an ACOG can get you. When there are many of these punks around you're going to want to shoot faster. God forbid somebody should want a more suitable weapon. I guess all these snipers in real life with M4s and semi-auto sniper rifles are a bunch of skill-less noobs. Or wait, it could be because they'd much rather stay alive and increase their effectiveness but whatever--let's just throw reality out the window. Anything else we should defenestrate because of prejudice?

[Eddie Baker]

Okay, stow the electronic ****-waving. Unless you are a bona fide sniper/DM or the leader of a unit that employs them, anything any of you has to say on these subjects is speculation, assumption and edicated guesses, no matter how much research you have done. And if you do indeed have the credentials to speak on these topics, should you really be discussing them on an open forum? I only know of three people who have the credentials on this forum with regards to snipers and one with regards to designated marksmen. If they actually want to bother with this thread, they can post here.

[Solid Knight]

Okay, stow the electronic ****-waving. Unless you are a bona fide sniper/DM or the leader of a unit that employs them, anything any of you has to say on these subjects is speculation, assumption and edicated guesses, no matter how much research you have done. And if you do indeed have the credentials to speak on these topics, should you really be discussing them on an open forum? I only know of three people who have the credentials on this forum with regards to "sniper" and one with regards to "designated marksman." If they actually want to bother with this thread, they can post here.

I don't have to be a real sniper to know how a damn gun works in an urban setting nor do I have to be a real sniper to know that a lot of semi-automatic sniper rifles are used in urban settings by snipers. Just like I don't have to be a real sniper to know they don't use ghillie suits in urban settings. Just like I don't have to go into outer space to know the world is round. All of which can easily by found out by observation. If you want it your way, due to my former job I've seen enough to know. I may not have been a sniper myself but that doesn't prevent me from being able to identify weapons when I see them.

[Eddie Baker]

I don't have to be a real sniper to know how a damn gun works in an urban setting nor do I have to be a real sniper to know that a lot of semi-automatic sniper rifles are used in urban settings by snipers. Just like I don't have to be a real sniper to know they don't use ghillie suits in urban settings. Just like I don't have to go into outer space to know the world is round. All of which can easily by found out by observation. If you want it your way, due to my former job I've seen enough to know. I may not have been a sniper myself but that doesn't prevent me from being able to identify weapons when I see them.

I am not disputing your firearms knowledge. However, from my own research, the only thing that seems to matter aside from the ghillie suit with regards to urban sniping is shooting position and tactics, since firing from the prone/supported position is impractical much of the time. Semi-automatic rifles are a tool in the bag for it, but they are not the only tool; I imagine it comes down to personal preference and what they have available. If you go to the US military sites and search photos relating to urban sniper training/employment, they are just as if not more likely to be using their bolt-action rifles.

The only thing that will sway us either way on this issue on this is information from bona fide sources. Because of this, this thread has been nothing but pointless arguing about what is essentially an "I want new toys" suggestion.

Okay, so we try to get authentic semi-automatic rifles for each faction for all snipers on urban maps. And the semi-automatic precision rifles (or LSWs pressed into service as such) in use by each faction for their marksmen kit are exactly what that class will get in the majority of cases. So, what you end up with is a slightly different marksman kit with a pistol. Then what will happen is:

"Why does this sniper kit have this (LSW)- this faction's snipers don't use this and/or it isn't new and cool enough and/or isn't "balanced" with the other factions'- can't we have this item that is newer and more powerful and cooler and/or that I cannot actually verify is in service with this faction or in the region?"

I think what it boils down to is that the original poster wants the Mk-11/M110 in the game for the US, since he had been keen on suggesting it and other new toys in previous posts.

[@bsurd]

let the kit as it is... I´ve used right everything is fine.

I often play the sniper role, but i have no need to engage close targets.

I dont even shoot @ targets that to close because i dont wanne give away my position! And i´ve i get in trouble, my m8 take out the close targets with his silenced pistol

Thats the only way to have fun with the sniper kit AND play the hole round without dieing once...

My Spotter is the SL, and i as shooter be only a member. So the spotter can give intel to the commander, set me markers (for the range) and tells my witch target i have to engage first.

Btw. What you want with a semi automatic sniper rifle? You have to wait 2-4 sec between each shot to get the rifle 100 % accurate. In this time you can reload a bolt action rifle twice...

[Waaah_Wah]

Ramiel and Muttrah, you want to duplicate a kit for two maps? You want to remodel the kit geo, model the weapon and get new animations for two fething maps?

And Al Basrah, Karbala, Korengal, EJOD and god knows how many more.

[gazzthompson]

so basically every map apart from kashan ?

[Waaah_Wah]

let the kit as it is... I´ve used right everything is fine.

I often play the sniper role, but i have no need to engage close targets.

I dont even shoot @ targets that to close because i dont wanne give away my position! And i´ve i get in trouble, my m8 take out the close targets with his silenced pistol

Thats the only way to have fun with the sniper kit AND play the hole round without dieing once...

My Spotter is the SL, and i as shooter be only a member. So the spotter can give intel to the commander, set me markers (for the range) and tells my witch target i have to engage first.

Btw. What you want with a semi automatic sniper rifle? You have to wait 2-4 sec between each shot to get the rifle 100 % accurate. In this time you can reload a bolt action rifle twice...

You dont need to have the rifle 100% accurate when shooting center mass at less than 200 meters.

[arjan]

i think a SR-25 is the answer for the ''urban sniper'' but eh, that allready suggested

[Waaah_Wah]

Btw, to all of you telling him to use the marksman kit, thats not what the kit is for. In 0.8, the DM is only marginally more accurate than a regulary rifleman while the sniper will hit dead on at 600 meters. The DM kit also has a terrible scope compared to the sniper kit and is very hard to use at long ranges.

A semi automatic sniper rifle would indeed come in handy, and be realistic on urban maps.

[Howitzer]

explain how im saying a sniper what it's not. All im saying is that sniper's are a key asset to the battlefield. Your saying, if im not wrong, that those objective's can be accomplished by a advanced marksmen who still has the role of a squad member.

As for equipment, all im saying is to change the sniper's weapon to a semi automatic weapon that is more suitable in a CQB area, where target's appear quicker, and the delay for cycling a new round should be eliminated because the delay can mean a difference for an enemies spotting you and shooting you, or escaping and telling the rest of the squad where your position is - or being able to eliminate the enemy(s) in a shorter time.


The weapon of choice would be up to the DEV team (all I'm saying is to change it to a semi auto weapon - not being specific on which one) but of course that could be one suggestion.
A field dressing is pretty much already included, and i don't know about grenades, but a grapple could help with certain places a sniper could use for a good overview. But so far, the default equipment is good enough.

take a minute , just think abour the guy your are talking about;

Semi-automatic sniper rifle -> like the M21 -> The marksman has it
Grapping hook and other goodies -> The spec ops you are teamed with has it

What else do you want ?

[Waaah_Wah]

Semi-automatic sniper rifle -> like the M21 -> The marksman has it

You want snipers to be in 3 man squads taking away weapons that a 6 man inf squad could need?

[Solid Knight]

Defense Tech: Take a Look at the Army's New Sniper Rifle

XM110 SRSS Sniper Rifle Fielded

http://www.army.mil/-news/2007/04/23/28 ... ew-weapon/

Knight's Armament SR-25, Stoner Rifle 25, 308 Caliber, SASS

Pretty much backs up everything I've said.

[Howitzer]

You want snipers to be in 3 man squads taking away weapons that a 6 man inf squad could need?

hum... true...

The next best thing would be a Big zoom SASS but its probably already suggested

[Bringerof_D]

ok seriously ppl no new sniper kit, just give the sniper a semi auto rifle and/or give the marksman a better scope, it's as simple as that, new kit is not necesary, and so far i keep seeing people post about wanting a semi rifle for a sniper...again give the marksman a better scope and the deal is done, the DMR is not as accurate as a sniper rifle ingame only because of the way the devs made it, if they just fix it it would all be fine. IRL a DMR is still a sniper rifle, it is just as acurate.

@waaah_wah: THEN ASK FOR A BETTER SCOPE! the sniper doesnt need a new weapon, the marksman just needs a better scope. and yeah because IRL you would be able to swing a 5.2 kg rifle around fast enough and sight on a moving target fast enough to need the kind of firing speed you're asking for. if you had the targets right across the street irl with a weapon of that weight and caliber you wouldnt even have your barrel pointed at the second guy before they shot you. so your weapons firing speed is irrelevant and is pointless, you would be dead regardless. on another note even if they gave you such a high rate of fire, you wouldnt even land the 2nd shot within a foot of the guy with the deviation system