hmm, response

[jubasniper00]

by the way the pr ak47 is not a real variant, the receiver cover should not be like that, it looks like the akm. just look at the pr ak47 and a picture of a real ak47 and u ll c what im tlking about then look at the picture of an akm.

oh and by the way my last thread got locked but with all due respect I still dont think that the "we cant have another ak because there are already enough variants response" doesnt make a point, ure supposed to adjust to reality and in reality insurgents dont use a shotgun just because everybody else is using aks, and that hurts theyr image rite?the insurgents using shotguns are original they dont care about not being efective and killed fast in combat rite?

Oh and uh how can u represent a variant of a weapon wth another variant? howcould u represent the better accuracy of one model with another? making it more accurate u might say? they ure not being real ak47 are less acurate therefore they cant represent an akm wich is a somewhat different and more accurate weapon, so if insurgents are using akms then we shall have them if insurgents all deceide to jump off a building then we shall imitate it in some way too because this is the theme of the game and the game adjusts to reality

[Ace42]

If you wanted the topic unlocked, should've PMd the mod who closed it. While modelling tons of AK-47 variants is unnecessary (Personally I think the Al-Quds is rather superflous given the PKM being in-game), there could conceivably be a place for an AKM, if it wasn't for the fact that the AK-74 variant in-game is already identical to an AKM, and subtle changes in deviation etc would be TOTALLY IMPERCEPTIBLE in game.

An AK-101 would be nice, given that there's already one in the vBF2 engine, and with the different projectile, would good to distinguish it from the current AK-74.

[jubasniper00]

If you wanted the topic unlocked, should've PMd the mod who closed it. While modelling tons of AK-47 variants is unnecessary (Personally I think the Al-Quds is rather superflous given the PKM being in-game), there could conceivably be a place for an AKM, if it wasn't for the fact that the AK-74 variant in-game is already identical to an AKM, and subtle changes in deviation etc would be TOTALLY IMPERCEPTIBLE in game.

An AK-101 would be nice, given that there's already one in the vBF2 engine, and with the different projectile, would good to distinguish it from the current AK-74.

nah i didnt want the topic unlocked, i did a bad job and i did suggest maybe too much. i agree with u on the al quds at some point, but i find it that somnetimes variety is nessesary, I dont think they should model tons of ak variants I just think they should model the real ak variants being used today, the ak74 is not identical because akm shoots the same cartridge as the ak47 but it is more stable and accurate that the 47, changes in deviation are not needed just bcaus it is an ak it is not used as a sniper rifle, but what i mean is grouping, an auto akm should have more shots grouped together at a certain distance that an ak47, that makes it more efective and at the same time it serves the purpose of eliminating the useles kit that has the shotgun while aporting variety to the game, and about the 101 dude I dont think they are available to insurgents just bcause it is too modern to be mass supplied to them, remember they use the old ak rifles bcause in the past they have been supplied in big quantities, ak101 in theother hand forms part of the modern era and in this era there are some regulations that prevent countries from floding another with military weapons,that and russia being a different nation with not as mucb power as the soviet union

[jubasniper00]

akm should b really easy 4 them to make just use the ak74 buttplate the pr ak47 receiver cover and the rest is a normal ak47 with some canges and an akm tip

[Ace42]

I just think they should model the real ak variants being used today, the ak74 is not identical because akm shoots the same cartridge as the ak47 but it is more stable and accurate that the 47,

"These modifications [to the AKM] were primarily the result of converting the rifle to the intermediate-caliber 5.45x39mm cartridge, in fact, some early models [of the AK-74] are reported to have been converted AKMs, with the barrel resleeved to 5.45x39mm."

AK-74 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The three rifles are incredibly similar alraedy, there doesn't need to be three different ones, the 74 and the 47 are already in the game - why add a middle one that is near-identical to the other two?

changes in deviation are not needed just bcaus it is an ak it is not used as a sniper rifle, but what i mean is grouping

Grouping of shots is solely down to a combination of deviation and recoil. Neither would be significantly different between the guns to make it a worthwhile addition.

akm should b really easy 4 them to make

Not as easy as just giving the shotgun kit an AK-47 or 74 that's already in game...

it serves the purpose of eliminating the useles kit that has the shotgun while aporting variety to the game

The shotgun kit is pretty useless (breaching slugs don't outweigh the redundancy of the main gun), but replacing a realistic gun with an unnecessary one is just extra busy work. There are better ways to make the kit useful - possibly by adding some spare field dressings and a grapple hook; or an ammo bag.

[torenico]

Im suggestion you something.

Community Modding. Learn modding and do your AKs..


I really.. Really dont see any problem whit the AK's.. they are just fine.

[jubasniper00]

"These modifications [to the AKM] were primarily the result of converting the rifle to the intermediate-caliber 5.45x39mm cartridge, in fact, some early models [of the AK-74] are reported to have been converted AKMs, with the barrel resleeved to 5.45x39mm."

AK-74 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The three rifles are incredibly similar alraedy, there doesn't need to be three different ones, the 74 and the 47 are already in the game - why add a middle one that is near-identical to the other two?



Grouping of shots is solely down to a combination of deviation and recoil. Neither would be significantly different between the guns to make it a worthwhile addition.



Not as easy as just giving the shotgun kit an AK-47 or 74 that's already in game...



The shotgun kit is pretty useless (breaching slugs don't outweigh the redundancy of the main gun), but replacing a realistic gun with an unnecessary one is just extra busy work. There are better ways to make the kit useful - possibly by adding some spare field dressings and a grapple hook; or an ammo bag.

ok now that u finished reading wikipedia, hmmm the akm wasnt converted to 5.45x39mm it was the akm being converted to ak74 using 5.45x39mm bullets.

as I said bfore that comment about having too many variants doesnt have a point, mainly because of this... the ak47 shoots a more powerfull caliber than the ak74 right? therefore it as more stopping power, but it has a lot of recoil, the ak74 doesnt have that much recoil therefore it has a more controlled fire wich results in a mroe accurate soldier, but the same happens with the m16 it doesnt have that much stopping power, ok the middle one is like combining the 2 u have stopping power and u have less control then the 74 but more than 47 so it is like having a little of the 2 worlds.

ok if u think the differences btween akm and ak47 are not worth it then why did the russians change theyr ak47 to akms when they got out? if the difference was so small then they should have stayed with old ak47s rite? to answer that any small difference on the battlefield is worth it therefore at the sight of a small difference in real life the russians changed theyr ak47s to akms, why is that so important well because it is reality and this game is supposed to b as close to reality as posible, take another 5 minutes and read ure wikipedia but this time about the akm and ull find that it says its is the most widespread ak variant.

and actually if u think the akm is unnesesary then why did the devs made the ak74su? if it is unnesesary just because you already ahve enough ak variants in game...

[jubasniper00]

Im suggestion you something.

Community Modding. Learn modding and do your AKs..


I really.. Really dont see any problem whit the AK's.. they are just fine.

haha loco i dont c any problem with the aks too I just happen to think they should add another one so the game is mroe real, oh and I dont think ill b able o learn modding i jsut dont have the skillz for it man, oh and "if ure argentino then que viva boca juniors!!"

[Ace42]

ok now that u finished reading wikipedia, hmmm the akm wasnt converted to 5.45x39mm it was the akm being converted to ak74 using 5.45x39mm bullets.

They were converting AKMs to CREATE the *first* AK-74s, by resleeving the barrel. Precisely what I, and Wiki, said; and which supports my point. I appreciate English isn't your first language, but do try to keep up.

as I said bfore that comment about having too many variants doesnt have a point, mainly because of this... the ak47 shoots a more powerfull caliber than the ak74 right? therefore it as more stopping power, but it has a lot of recoil, the ak74 doesnt have that much recoil therefore it has a more controlled fire wich results in a mroe accurate soldier,

The dynamics of the guns is a lot more complicated and sophisticated than that. You can't infer damage / handling solely from a change in projectile and barrel sleeving. Furthermore, the AK-47 and 74 are already in the game and both handle pretty similarly anyway. Adding an "inbetween" version which makes the distinctions even LESS tangible is totally pointless. You may as well put in a 47 or a 74.

ok if u think the differences btween akm and ak47 are not worth it then why did the russians change theyr ak47 to akms when they got out?

"Compared to the AK-47, the AKM features enhancements that optimized the rifle for mass production"

"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akm"

The differences are the AKM is cheaper and easier to build. As the price and ease of manufacture has no bearing on PR, the distinction is irrelevant.

and actually if u think the akm is unnesesary then why did the devs made the ak74su? if it is unnesesary just because you already ahve enough ak variants in game...

The AKS-74u is a CARBINE, not an assault rifle, and the only carbine the INS get I believe. And I fail to see how listing an ADDITIONAL AK variant makes a case for adding even MORE of them. If anything, it merely makes the point that there's more than enough in the game already...

[Snazz]

Adding one more AK variant might increase the realism but seems very low priority and insignificant overall.

If you want to pick apart the mod's realism there's plenty of more significant elements to target, such as 'WTF is MEC?' and 'Why the hell is the coalition invading China?' (Yes I know those 2 unrealistic premises are migrated from vBF2, just using them as examples).

[McBumLuv]

Why all the AK hate? I think they are all great additions to the mod, offering many different possibilities. I mean, sure, you could say that they aren't all needed, but the same works the other way around.

Why was the M4 created when we already had an M-16? They have fewer differences than most of the AK variants do between them, and they both use the same caliber, too.

But about the actual topic... what? I really don't understand... is it a critique or a suggestion?

[jubasniper00]

They were converting AKMs to CREATE the *first* AK-74s, by resleeving the barrel. Precisely what I, and Wiki, said; and which supports my point. I appreciate English isn't your first language, but do try to keep up.

"The three rifles are incredibly similar alraedy, there doesn't need to be three different ones, the 74 and the 47 are already in the game - why add a middle one that is near-identical to the other two?"

thats what u said before quoting wikipedia, so lets c what is wrong with that... hmmm oh yes ak74 and akm not being "near identical" thats why i said that


The dynamics of the guns is a lot more complicated and sophisticated than that. You can't infer damage / handling solely from a change in projectile and barrel sleeving. Furthermore, the AK-47 and 74 are already in the game and both handle pretty similarly anyway. Adding an "inbetween" version which makes the distinctions even LESS tangible is totally pointless. You may as well put in a 47 or a 74.

yes they are but, hmmm lets c can we infer wich one does mroe damage a 7.6 or a .22? hmm made my point rite?

"Compared to the AK-47, the AKM features enhancements that optimized the rifle for mass production"

"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akm"

The differences are the AKM is cheaper and easier to build. As the price and ease of manufacture has no bearing on PR, the distinction is irrelevant

yes but u failed to read the name of the rifle"akm=ak modernized" modernized meaning hmmm beter! read a little more and if ure gonna quote information dont just quote the info that helps u proove ure so called point.

The AKS-74u is a CARBINE, not an assault rifle, and the only carbine the INS get I believe. And I fail to see how listing an ADDITIONAL AK variant makes a case for adding even MORE of them. If anything, it merely makes the point that there's more than enough in the game already...

no that prooves the point that devs understand that games need variety, in this case the ak74u aint inportant and the shotgun eighter, but they add them because they understand that unlike some ppl

[jubasniper00]

oh damn haha i messed that last post

[ReadMenace]

by the way the pr ak47 is not a real variant, the receiver cover should not be like that, it looks like the akm. just look at the pr ak47 and a picture of a real ak47 and u ll c what im tlking about then look at the picture of an akm.

Virtually all Kalashnikov top covers are interchangeable, exceptions being the 74SU (and any similar variants) the Saiga shotgun family, and the Saiga 1XX series.

While we're nitpicking the Kalashnikovs in game.. Why don't you mention that the AK74 should not have a folding stock mechanism... Both he AK74M and AK74SU need a the forward locking latch for retaining the stock while folded.

(Personally I think the Al-Quds is rather superflous given the PKM being in-game)

How is the Al Quds superfluous? It is a SAW rather than a GPMG, it is chambered in an intermediate cartridge (7.62x39) not a full sized rifle cartridge (7.62x54r). Additionally, it was and continues to be employed by the Iraqis in far greater numbers than the PKM.

The differences are the AKM is cheaper and easier to build. As the price and ease of manufacture has no bearing on PR, the distinction is irrelevant.

+1000
The stamped receiver has little effect on overall function of the weapon when compared to a milled reciever.

The AKS-74u is a CARBINE, not an assault rifle, and the only carbine the INS get I believe. And I fail to see how listing an ADDITIONAL AK variant makes a case for adding even MORE of them. If anything, it merely makes the point that there's more than enough in the game already...

AK74SU is a considered an SMG by most, and AKs of all other variants (save the RPK/Tabuk) are considered carbines, as is the SKS.

Blahblahblah..

-REad

[Ace42]

Why all the AK hate? I think they are all great additions to the mod, offering many different possibilities.

There's no AK hate, I love them too. The point is merely that introducing a "middle-ground" between the existing AKs is totally superfluous - if you want more accuracy, use the 74, if you want a higher calibre slug, use the 47, if you want better handling, use the AKS-74u. There's no need for an additional "middle ground" weapon when the existing ones are nearly indistinguishable as it stands.

Why was the M4 created when we already had an M-16? They have fewer differences than most of the AK variants do between them, and they both use the same caliber, too.

The M4's a carbine.

But about the actual topic... what? I really don't understand... is it a critique or a suggestion?

It's a (legitimate) criticism of the shotgun kit; and a spurious suggestion for a replacement main weapon.

[jubasniper00]

Why all the AK hate? I think they are all great additions to the mod, offering many different possibilities. I mean, sure, you could say that they aren't all needed, but the same works the other way around.

Why was the M4 created when we already had an M-16? They have fewer differences than most of the AK variants do between them, and they both use the same caliber, too.

But about the actual topic... what? I really don't understand... is it a critique or a suggestion?

nah it is a suggestion, I cant find a way of critizicing the devs work when they have brought us so many happyness I just want it to be more happy u know?

[jubasniper00]

There's no AK hate, I love them too. The point is merely that introducing a "middle-ground" between the existing AKs is totally superfluous - if you want more accuracy, use the 74, if you want a higher calibre slug, use the 47, if you want better handling, use the AKS-74u. There's no need for an additional "middle ground" weapon when the existing ones are nearly indistinguishable as it stands.



The M4's a carbine.



It's a (legitimate) criticism of the shotgun kit; and a spurious suggestion for a replacement main weapon.

this kid just wants to proove his point, dude accept it while it is not a nessesary thing, psichologically and for the sake of the game it could b a great adittion, human beings need variety, they need options in order to live, thats why comunism hasnt worked or socialism.

[Ace42]

How is the Al Quds superfluous? It is a SAW rather than a GPMG, it is chambered in an intermediate cartridge (7.62x39) not a full sized rifle cartridge (7.62x54r). Additionally, it was and continues to be employed by the Iraqis in far greater numbers than the PKM.

Because the magazine size, accuracy and lethality mean that you may as well go for any of the starting-kit AKs instead, they can be used in exactly the same manner with near identical results.

We're talking about their usefulness IN GAME, not in-game cosmetics.

AK74SU is a considered an SMG by most, and AKs of all other variants (save the RPK/Tabuk) are considered carbines, as is the SKS.

According to what definition?

"A carbine is a firearm similar to a rifle or musket, but generally shorter and of lesser power. Many carbines, especially modern designs, were developed from rifles, being essentially shortened versions of full rifles firing the same ammunition, although often at a lower velocity."

Sounds like a perfect definition of the 'SU to me, and I'd describe the AK-47 (and most similar variants) as the prototypical assault rifle...

Not that I wish to argue semantics with you or anyone, as this is all really OT, but I am interested to hear what criteria you are using for the descriptions for purely academic reasons.

psichologically and for the sake of the game it could b a great adittion, human beings need variety, they need options in order to live

EXCEPT THERE'S NO VARIETY APART FROM THE COSMETIC APPEARANCE. The differences in damage, deviation, recoil, etc in game would be INTANGIBLE. I like variety, but I like the variety to be meaningful and significant. If all you want is more pretty pictures, why not just ask the devs to put the AK-101 model in from BF2 and just copy the stats from any other AK?

thats why comunism hasnt worked or socialism.

Wow, don't we have an intellectual in our midst? I didn't realise that the fall of communist and socialist nations is solely down to there not being enough pretty gun pictures in PR...

[McBumLuv]

There's no AK hate, I love them too. The point is merely that introducing a "middle-ground" between the existing AKs is totally superfluous - if you want more accuracy, use the 74, if you want a higher calibre slug, use the 47, if you want better handling, use the AKS-74u. There's no need for an additional "middle ground" weapon when the existing ones are nearly indistinguishable as it stands.

Ah, I see, I didn't quite understand.

[torenico]

"if ure argentino then que viva boca juniors!!"

Not really.. i hate Boca.