Weapon aiming does not fit reality

[seamus2008]

I think we all agree that
More long range engagements, more semi-auto less running and more ducking behind cover is good/realistic/fun
Right now most kills are made with auto spray within 50 meters, which reminds me of modern warfare...
Also people aren't afraid of being shot at. Right now I can sprint across a covered street unscathed.
Not being afraid to be shot at leads to unrealistic/lame tactics where a combination of laser accuracy and more damaging bullet will interdict movement and lead to much slower and more long-range firefights along with realistic tactics such as cover arcs, smoke screens etc..
Deviation time is fine, but after those seconds, I want semi-auto to have laser accuracy at around until around 500m.
Also, one rifle bullet to torso = critically wounded
one bullet to leg/arm = critical bleed
and more suppression from rifles. Anything to keep those heads down
Thoughts?

[Dev1200]

Deviation is a necessary part of Project Reality, until they manage to add working weapon sway, wind, the bullet coming out of the barrel and not the sight, etc.


IE arma ololol.

[seamus2008]

You didn't get my post deviation is GOOD, I have no problem with deviation
But after these seconds my M16 should shoot semi auto LASER beams at 1 round per second or so. This is how you prevent the guy from sprinting across the street. Right now you need several guys to overlap the covering arcs, which is bad

[Haji with a Handgun]

Deviation has actually grown on me. I used to curse it, but now I see it as a necessary part of PR. My only advice, deal with it.

[seamus2008]

Deviation has actually grown on me. I used to curse it, but now I see it as a necessary part of PR. My only advice, deal with it.

How many times do I have to say that DEVIATION IS GOOD. It's the accuracy that comes after the waiting time which has nothing to do with deviation. It should be more accurate

[Haji with a Handgun]

Oh, my bad. I just see these threads pop up all the time and I assumed you were going to ***** about deviation. As for your post, I agree with you somewhat. Its very hard to re-create fear in a video game, because ts not your *** on the line. The full-auto spray is something that will never change. even if deviation was 10x was it is now, people would still spray the hell out of each other. I don't use semi-auto most of the time, just because I like to squeeze off a few shots in rapid succession and also have the option to open up on them.

[SoB-Rindee]

I never saw a problem with the aiming in PR, if anything I think its even MORE accurate than BF2. I remember having my sights on a guy in BF2 and totally missing half the semi auto shots I took. Close range was easier in BF2 though.

The aiming was not a huge adjustment for me, movement was, and so were the tactics.

If the aiming were to be ultra realistic, the sights would be moving under ALL conditions. No one can hold a rifle perfectly straight, even while prone. But I have found in trying to apply actual weapons techniques to the video game world, most people make BAD games.

[Rissien]

I have no problem getting kills when deviation is settled. Heck I still see idiots jumping prone to shoot back when I start shooting them, free kill every time

[General Dragosh]

Im mostly fine with deviation . . .

Except in this situation :

I run/sprint for 20 seconds and turn after the corner then i come across 3 enemys, my reaction of course full auto on 3 targets, of course in reality they would be dead withing an eye blink, but in PR one gets badly injured and the other 2 magicly survive because my AK magicly decided to magicly avoid them and then i get shot because of the darn deviation, what i want personally is that i want to kill 3 people at 15 meters at full auto, because the deviation for close range goes like high drugged at times (actually mostly )

[badmojo420]

Im mostly fine with deviation . . .

Except in this situation :

I run/sprint for 20 seconds and turn after the corner then i come across 3 enemys, my reaction of course full auto on 3 targets, of course in reality they would be dead withing an eye blink, but in PR one gets badly injured and the other 2 magicly survive because my AK magicly decided to magicly avoid them and then i get shot because of the darn deviation, what i want personally is that i want to kill 3 people at 15 meters at full auto, because the deviation for close range goes like high drugged at times (actually mostly )

I had that exact scenario happen to me last night. I sprinted to the corner of a compound on Kokan and rounded the corner to see 3 US soldiers coming towards me, about 20m away. I took a knee and opened up with my AK on full auto and a couple seconds later they were all dead, and I still had half a magazine left.

[RealKail]

The deviation does need some work. In my opinion, 5 seconds is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too long of a settle time. Somewhere in the range of 2-3 seconds would be more ideal, 5 is just highly unrealistic, unless you're a marksman setting up for a long range shot.

Too many times have I come around a corner to a few enemies and opened up on them at nearly point blank range with my sights up, and the shots hit everything BUT their intended target. To be honest, anyone that bad wouldn't have passed their quals and damn sure shouldn't be carrying a rifle.

I understand deviation is needed, and I love the fact that the concept was though of for this mod. However, the current deviation needs some serious tweaking. I've suggested it before, but bringing your sights up to should drastically reduce the deviation, more so than it does now.

Earlier today I was on Ramiel playing co-op, had been laying prone for a while, a collaberator jumped in to a technical not 10m from me, and I could not hit him at all. Understand I'd been laying in my position for at least 20 seconds. Now some might chalk that up to the bad hitboxes on the technicals (which do need to be fixed) but my shots didn't even hit the technical itself.

I'm not asking for CoD style insta-aiming, but like I said, 5 seconds is waaaaaay too long to have to wait for settle time for anything less than deployed marksman or a sniper rifle. Speaking of marksman rifle, how about reducing some of the undeployed deviation? These are highly trained marksmen after all, they're capable of putting down fairly accurate fire even without being at rest on something.

[badmojo420]

Speaking of marksman rifle, how about reducing some of the undeployed deviation? These are highly trained marksmen after all, they're capable of putting down fairly accurate fire even without being at rest on something.

You don't need to be resting on anything in deployed mode. You can be standing in an open field.

The undeployed deviation is very generous. You're wielding a long rifle with a big scope and have the same deviation as any assault rifle. No way a guy with an SVD or M14 will be MORE capable of moving and shooting than a guy with an assault rifle. That wouldn't be logical.

[TmanEd]

The deviation does need some work. In my opinion, 5 seconds is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too long of a settle time.

In my experience, the whole five seconds is really only needed when you're shooting at long ranges. Just sighting in seems to be adequate for close ranges. Also, be sure you're shooting for center mass, because even if it doesn't exactly hit where you're aiming, it's likely to hit something.

[Arnoldio]

Only max deviation when scoped in should be decreased and else is just about right.

[Shaheed]

as an engineer i am well-educated in mathematics and the problem with deviation (max distance from your aimpoint und where the shot propably goes) is that in reality it increases nonlinear relativ to the distance and the angle of your weapon, but in PR i think it's linear coded! in RL it is nonlinear more probable, lets say easier, to hit a target on near distance than on long distance, because the area of your target decreases quadratic as a function of the distance. maybe the DEVs can implement 2 deviation functions. the first one for the time interval 0-2 sec where the deviation reduces from 100% to 25%. and the second deviation function for the time interval from 2-5 sec where the deviation reduces from 25% to 0 % or what ever!
so everyone can faster shoot on targets at 100 m distance but still have to wait the full 5 sec for targets at 250 -300 m!! i dont no if thats possible with the bf2 engine, but lets call it a idea!!
greetz

[BenHamish]

Shaheed sounds similar to me wanting the bullets to have a curving trajectory. So that they are all accurate to the sights at 10m, but then get increasingly inaccurate as the distance increases.

At the moment I feel that with deviation settled the rifles are accurate enough But I don't use scopes.

[RealKail]

You don't need to be resting on anything in deployed mode. You can be standing in an open field.

The undeployed deviation is very generous. You're wielding a long rifle with a big scope and have the same deviation as any assault rifle. No way a guy with an SVD or M14 will be MORE capable of moving and shooting than a guy with an assault rifle. That wouldn't be logical.

As far as the resting, I was talking hypothetically in this game, because we can't really "rest" our weapons on surfaces.

I'm not suggesting that a marksman be more capable of running and gunning, but think about it, they're a fairly well trained soldier. They don't just hand out DMR rifles to ANYONE. They're trained to put shots downrange with higher accuracy than their other infantry brethren.

In my experience, the whole five seconds is really only needed when you're shooting at long ranges. Just sighting in seems to be adequate for close ranges. Also, be sure you're shooting for center mass, because even if it doesn't exactly hit where you're aiming, it's likely to hit something.

Well my experience is that the 5 seconds seems to be necessary even if your target is only 10m from you. And I already know to shoot a target center mass, that's infantry marksmanship 101.

Shaheed sounds similar to me wanting the bullets to have a curving trajectory. So that they are all accurate to the sights at 10m, but then get increasingly inaccurate as the distance increases.

At the moment I feel that with deviation settled the rifles are accurate enough But I don't use scopes.

I can agree with having some bullet "curvature", which is why I've stated in the past the regular infantry weapons shouldn't be "laser accurate". Instead there should be a small, but decent sized circle left so they can fight effectively at short ranges, but have a lesser chance to hit targets at long range. Currently I've managed to hit people at ranges of 500-600m with an ACOG scoped M4 with one to two shots.

[Garack]

the system now is much better then in 0.8 versions of PR, but it happens to often that 2 guys fire each other from 10-20 metres and do not hit. Not in 3 shot and not in full auto...

I mean 10 metres and of course in ironsightmode.

Make hitting close opponents a little more easy is my suggestion.

[badmojo420]

I'm not suggesting that a marksman be more capable of running and gunning, but think about it, they're a fairly well trained soldier. They don't just hand out DMR rifles to ANYONE. They're trained to put shots downrange with higher accuracy than their other infantry brethren.

And they can put shots down range with higher accuracy and in quicker succession, at longer distances with better zoom, but only when they're deployed.

If you improved the un-deployed marksman people would solo with the kit more, which is unrealistic & undesired by most of the community.

[Atkinson]

Is there a possibility to add the weapon sway animation that portrays the amount of deviation/spread?

If I understood it correctly it is not possible to have a sway where the bullets go where the barrel points but it is possible to add an superficial sway that does not affect where bullets go.

Now it feels a bit weird cos you have no idea from the physical cues in the game when you are able to aim the most accurately.

Forgive me if I said something totally stupid, i am not that familiar yet how things work in BF2 world.