Best: addition of the SPR and the Sig Sauer, new game types and maps
Worst: I know this has been in for longer than .3, but I really don't like the grenade launcher trajectories. I also think that the MEC and Chinese should have little birds too, but that's not really a main concern. Also extended spawn times for one second every time you die isn't really a good thing if spawn time is already thirty seconds. I do like all of the other class and general game changes y'all made to promote teamwork and fight noobism, especially the new scoring system.
Overall and excellent update to this already good mod.
P.S.--I want my shotgun back too.
PRMM 0.3 Feedback Thread - Initial Impressions?
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Ferocious_Imbecile
- Posts: 884
- Joined: 2005-11-22 06:52
Back to the game...
I did actually get to play a bit today. The tanks and all vehicles are really much too fragile when travelling over the landscapes. Is this hard coded into the game? Or is this what you intended?
But on the positive side the Chinese maps are now the best. I don't remember who made them but damn, they look good and they play well. Lots of tactical nuances built into those Chinese maps. They're far superior to teh Vanilla Chinese maps for sure. Good stuff.
Also, to rebut the critics of medics; yes, they are ridiculous from the perspective of realism, but they do contribute to a certain aspect of gameplay; they help maintiain squad play. One or two get shot and the squad is done; regenerate way at the beginning of the map and try to struggle forward to rejoin your unit. It just doesn't work all that well. As unrealistic as medics are they help hold squads together and that makes for good tactical play. Otherwise things just tend to dengenerate into chaos.
I did actually get to play a bit today. The tanks and all vehicles are really much too fragile when travelling over the landscapes. Is this hard coded into the game? Or is this what you intended?
But on the positive side the Chinese maps are now the best. I don't remember who made them but damn, they look good and they play well. Lots of tactical nuances built into those Chinese maps. They're far superior to teh Vanilla Chinese maps for sure. Good stuff.
Also, to rebut the critics of medics; yes, they are ridiculous from the perspective of realism, but they do contribute to a certain aspect of gameplay; they help maintiain squad play. One or two get shot and the squad is done; regenerate way at the beginning of the map and try to struggle forward to rejoin your unit. It just doesn't work all that well. As unrealistic as medics are they help hold squads together and that makes for good tactical play. Otherwise things just tend to dengenerate into chaos.
Last edited by Ferocious_Imbecile on 2006-05-16 05:20, edited 1 time in total.
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twisted
- Posts: 127
- Joined: 2005-09-15 02:27
this mod is absolutley amazing. well done. etc etc.
however, a few things that dont come together properly.
1. night vision. - glowing people. blank lack textures that jump and change. adds up to sucky. rather get rid of it and go with dusk/dawn maps.
2. extraction mode should be fun. but at the moment its new and not very intuitive so people running around not really knowing wtf. often i have found the usa side tries to hunt the mec - resulting in the vip car not moving at all. a suggestion - make the usa points go down when the VIP car is unmanned. that way the action is encouraged. also people said it's over too quickly - so make the VIP vehicle a bit slower to encourage moving firefights. dedicated maps would be good because the current ones are too free flowing for this game mode.
3. the wounded effect thing is a bit irritating when you have 4 people per side and no medics. also reduced accuracy when wounded would be a good penalty to add rtaher than have all wounds = bleed to death. add a little variation
4. the engineers mp5 kicks too much. it is a very low recoil weapon in real life. and should be much more managable - escpecially when fired in bursts. prefer it a lot to the shotguns though. engineer should also carry 1 more mine .
5. ROF for some weapons seems a bit slow. is it so?
6. AT weapons need to make tanks scared. this means that a hit at the back or top of a tank = tank disabled and smoking. two hits on side = same thing.
but these are small things. you have created a mod that turn bf2 into a truly amazing game. well done.
however, a few things that dont come together properly.
1. night vision. - glowing people. blank lack textures that jump and change. adds up to sucky. rather get rid of it and go with dusk/dawn maps.
2. extraction mode should be fun. but at the moment its new and not very intuitive so people running around not really knowing wtf. often i have found the usa side tries to hunt the mec - resulting in the vip car not moving at all. a suggestion - make the usa points go down when the VIP car is unmanned. that way the action is encouraged. also people said it's over too quickly - so make the VIP vehicle a bit slower to encourage moving firefights. dedicated maps would be good because the current ones are too free flowing for this game mode.
3. the wounded effect thing is a bit irritating when you have 4 people per side and no medics. also reduced accuracy when wounded would be a good penalty to add rtaher than have all wounds = bleed to death. add a little variation
4. the engineers mp5 kicks too much. it is a very low recoil weapon in real life. and should be much more managable - escpecially when fired in bursts. prefer it a lot to the shotguns though. engineer should also carry 1 more mine .
5. ROF for some weapons seems a bit slow. is it so?
6. AT weapons need to make tanks scared. this means that a hit at the back or top of a tank = tank disabled and smoking. two hits on side = same thing.
but these are small things. you have created a mod that turn bf2 into a truly amazing game. well done.
Last edited by twisted on 2006-05-16 04:10, edited 1 time in total.
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hachichin
- Posts: 66
- Joined: 2006-05-15 03:21
I just downloaded the mod yesterday.
Here's my impressions and feedback:
Great mod! I'm a realism-buff allergic to vanilla BF2 so this came as a nice surprise. Only reason I bought BF2 was for Forgotten Hope 2. You've come far but there is still a lot to be improved naturally. Most importantly the AAS-system fails miserably in some maps. I can see the logic behind it but if the teams are somewhat equally matched it leads to nothing but trench-warfare without trenches. Bottomline: It's boring. You should be able to sneak past a frontline to capture something behind. If you want to concentrate the action make the changes on the map-design (have less flags for example).
Suggestion: Make the Specops-class able to capture flags outside the AAS-order.
Also you need to do something about class-limits. Red Orchestra: Ostfront has this (what a superb game by the way) and it works wonders. Limit the amount of specialized classes (specops, snipers etc). Have one unlimited "grunt" class (assault).
Vehicles. Make the tankcombat more realistic. It's already way better than BF2 - but this doesnt really mean much. Most modern MBT's can penetrate 800 mm's of armor at 2000 m. We need more one-shot kills. Sidehits should mean death almost every time. APC's shouldn't be able to take direct hits from tanks at point blank range and no angle on the armor.
Implement "hitzones" on the tank that rewards skill (or make for an rewarding explosion (ammo-storage hit).
Some of the maps just suck, sorry (should be improved without AAS though). Not a very constructive critique I know but I just had to get that out of my system.
Last but not least... If possible please do something about the bullet deviation. I know this seems to be an integral part of the engine but surely you can do atleast something about it? The bulletspread of now is not very realistic (I'm not an expert though). Can't you just minimize the initial "cone" of spread? It seems way too big for some weapons, esp when firing from prone etc.
Finally some praise for the long spawntimes on vehicles. 5 mins is a lot but it sure does increase the reward for taking someone out, aswell as increasing strategic thinking and limiting the standard kamikaze-mode of playing. Irritating with 12-years old wasting the heli after 5 mins of waiting time though.
Thank you for removing the flyboys of BF2. Those point and click-weapons with no limit afterburn just destroys all pleasure of flying in BF2.
Here's my impressions and feedback:
Great mod! I'm a realism-buff allergic to vanilla BF2 so this came as a nice surprise. Only reason I bought BF2 was for Forgotten Hope 2. You've come far but there is still a lot to be improved naturally. Most importantly the AAS-system fails miserably in some maps. I can see the logic behind it but if the teams are somewhat equally matched it leads to nothing but trench-warfare without trenches. Bottomline: It's boring. You should be able to sneak past a frontline to capture something behind. If you want to concentrate the action make the changes on the map-design (have less flags for example).
Suggestion: Make the Specops-class able to capture flags outside the AAS-order.
Also you need to do something about class-limits. Red Orchestra: Ostfront has this (what a superb game by the way) and it works wonders. Limit the amount of specialized classes (specops, snipers etc). Have one unlimited "grunt" class (assault).
Vehicles. Make the tankcombat more realistic. It's already way better than BF2 - but this doesnt really mean much. Most modern MBT's can penetrate 800 mm's of armor at 2000 m. We need more one-shot kills. Sidehits should mean death almost every time. APC's shouldn't be able to take direct hits from tanks at point blank range and no angle on the armor.
Implement "hitzones" on the tank that rewards skill (or make for an rewarding explosion (ammo-storage hit).
Some of the maps just suck, sorry (should be improved without AAS though). Not a very constructive critique I know but I just had to get that out of my system.
Last but not least... If possible please do something about the bullet deviation. I know this seems to be an integral part of the engine but surely you can do atleast something about it? The bulletspread of now is not very realistic (I'm not an expert though). Can't you just minimize the initial "cone" of spread? It seems way too big for some weapons, esp when firing from prone etc.
Finally some praise for the long spawntimes on vehicles. 5 mins is a lot but it sure does increase the reward for taking someone out, aswell as increasing strategic thinking and limiting the standard kamikaze-mode of playing. Irritating with 12-years old wasting the heli after 5 mins of waiting time though.
Thank you for removing the flyboys of BF2. Those point and click-weapons with no limit afterburn just destroys all pleasure of flying in BF2.
Last edited by hachichin on 2006-05-16 08:50, edited 1 time in total.
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Dandy
- Posts: 256
- Joined: 2005-08-13 17:40
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the.ultimate.maverick
- Posts: 1229
- Joined: 2006-02-19 23:49
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Tasadin
- Posts: 1
- Joined: 2006-05-12 09:22
Its pretty good!!!
i enjoyed the mod although I only played it for a bit on saturday after the best part of a bottle of vodka so my flying wasn't that good but it made my wife laugh so it aint all bad. It still needs refinement and I know its a work in progress but for me i feel the balance is going in the right direction - only very minor criticism is spawn times but i think thats cos i'm just used to VBF2 - nice work guys keep it up!! 
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kamandor
- Posts: 1
- Joined: 2005-09-12 04:47
Awesome!!!
Hey guys, just wanted to say that I am really enjoying your mod, it is absolutely incredible. I love how the gameplay forces everyone to think before they act, every time, as the punishment for stupid decisions is a solid 30 second wait.
Never before have I seen such teamwork and cooperation among groups of strangers. It is a thing of beauty to see squads run down streets together, sticking to the walls, providing (necessary) covering fire, working towards a common goal.
I have a few suggestions. I'm sure many others feel the same, but I think the death down time should be 25 seconds instead of 30. I know it seems minimal, but I think the 'waves' of spawns would be better spread out if it was every 25 seconds compared to every 30 and I just plain think 25 is more bearable than a whole 'half minute'.
Everything else is awesome, I love AAS, it's how BF should be, it creates such intense firefights and great battles. Gone are sporadic engagements, this is true war!!
Never before have I seen such teamwork and cooperation among groups of strangers. It is a thing of beauty to see squads run down streets together, sticking to the walls, providing (necessary) covering fire, working towards a common goal.
I have a few suggestions. I'm sure many others feel the same, but I think the death down time should be 25 seconds instead of 30. I know it seems minimal, but I think the 'waves' of spawns would be better spread out if it was every 25 seconds compared to every 30 and I just plain think 25 is more bearable than a whole 'half minute'.
Everything else is awesome, I love AAS, it's how BF should be, it creates such intense firefights and great battles. Gone are sporadic engagements, this is true war!!
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Ferocious_Imbecile
- Posts: 884
- Joined: 2005-11-22 06:52
I don't want to spam but I've just had my third and best session with this mod and I have to say, particularly to those who haven't tried it yet that the maps are fantastic not only to look at but play on too. El Alaimen is a wild battlefield with all sorts of great tactical potential; I had just driven my APC over the central ridge and was headed for the norhtern base when I spied a full squad of Marines running along the ridge. I opened fire on them and killed two. But they hit my APC with rockets and I jumped out before it blew. Cursing my clumsiness I flanked back and around to the crest of the ridge and advanced to where I thought the remaining four were...just over the rise and they were right on me! I wasted 3 of them and was killed by the last. Five kills in a row! I never did that in Vanilla. I ranked third for that match..
Dr. Mabuse, your Jungle Fever is beautiful, the perfect scene for some really vicious fighting. For some reason everyone chose to go as assault troops and the battle was filled with smoke grenades going off...lol...tall grass and smoke and bullets hissing at you from everywhere.
And that huge harbour with the bridge...OMG...that was SPECTACULAR... It was so real and the fighting was so intense, that I felt I was watching..was in a newsreel film..
I finally found a Japanese server that played fast for me. Japan and Australia are better contacts for the West Coast than New York is apparently...
Thank you all for so much fun. If this is just the mini mod my mind boggles to think of what a magnum opus the full deal will be..
Dr. Mabuse, your Jungle Fever is beautiful, the perfect scene for some really vicious fighting. For some reason everyone chose to go as assault troops and the battle was filled with smoke grenades going off...lol...tall grass and smoke and bullets hissing at you from everywhere.
And that huge harbour with the bridge...OMG...that was SPECTACULAR... It was so real and the fighting was so intense, that I felt I was watching..was in a newsreel film..
I finally found a Japanese server that played fast for me. Japan and Australia are better contacts for the West Coast than New York is apparently...
Thank you all for so much fun. If this is just the mini mod my mind boggles to think of what a magnum opus the full deal will be..
Last edited by Ferocious_Imbecile on 2006-05-16 16:12, edited 1 time in total.
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hachichin
- Posts: 66
- Joined: 2006-05-15 03:21
Which is why you need class-limits. If it's not possible due to the engine make spawnable kits like FH did with BF1942. Have specops-kits spawn in a certain building or similar.'[R-PUB wrote:maverick']Except everyone will go Spec ops...
Played some more now. The AAS in not all bad, it can be great. It's sad though that it is 100% dependent on good players that are willing to co-operate, which is very far from the norm.
Another thing I noticed is that many people doesn't seem to be aware of the differences of the Commander compared to VBF2. On several servers no squadleaders have requested Arty and when I ask them why they have said it's the Commander's job...
Is there a special trick one has to perform before being able to hit anything with the sniper-rifles? They are incredibly inaccurate, which doesn't seem right for some reason. I've had situations where I'm prone, 20 meters from my target, aiming straight for their upperbody/head, firing off several shots with not one shot hitting the target. Don't tell me my aim is lacking, please.
I used to think the BF2-snipers were inaccurate but those are laser-weapons compared to these. Is there something I've missed? Do I have to hold the scope/sight still for X amounts of seconds before I actually hit where I aim?
I have to say I love the way helis are in your mod, it's great with a realistic amount of hydras, and long-range TV's with a good gunner. It's also great that you have made the helis more vulnerable to AT-rockets.
Why is there no bobbing when the game is striving for realism? The movement feels almost Quake-like. BF2 is more realistic in this manner than PR.
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the.ultimate.maverick
- Posts: 1229
- Joined: 2006-02-19 23:49
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Garack
- Posts: 624
- Joined: 2006-05-04 07:20
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Ferocious_Imbecile
- Posts: 884
- Joined: 2005-11-22 06:52
Garack wrote:Press "TAB"
Higher Pings can be caused by more Content in the map and changes on the engine.
In PRMM is no higher ping then in vanilla.
I know that...it's the location of the servers. There aren't many servers yet. I had the same trouble with Vanilla BF2 until I started playing West Coast and Australian servers...The East Coast and Europe delivers terrible ping rates here..
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six7
- Posts: 1784
- Joined: 2006-03-06 03:17
I really love everything about .3 except the toning down of the AT class. They are already disadvantaged to infantry (as they should be), but now they can't even destroy a transport vehicle in 1 hit. Tanks are also difficult to destroy. It takes 2 hits to the rear to take them out, and even then the tank catches on fire for long enough that the crew can escape unscathed. It is also more idffiscult now that you can't instantly resupply (which is a great addition). I now have basicly no incentive to play AT because I can't get kills anymore, and destroying a tank isn't worth enough for all the trouble it takes.
Another extremely minor issue is some of the point values in game. I was in the Tunguska on El Alemain and quite effectivly pwning aircraft . After the game was ove, I had killed at least 4 jets and quite a few choppers to boot, but I was near last place on the chart. The next round i decided to get in the APC and baserape infantry, and got the gold star by a longshot. I feel like destroying powerful forces liek jets and tanks is doing your team a much greater service than picking off lone infantrymen, and should be rewarded as such.
One final thing, does the SAW overheat in 5 seconds IRL? I find it difficult to give supressive fire when my gun does more hissing than firing
I love this mod and only want to make it better. Keep up the good work
Another extremely minor issue is some of the point values in game. I was in the Tunguska on El Alemain and quite effectivly pwning aircraft
. After the game was ove, I had killed at least 4 jets and quite a few choppers to boot, but I was near last place on the chart. The next round i decided to get in the APC and baserape infantry, and got the gold star by a longshot. I feel like destroying powerful forces liek jets and tanks is doing your team a much greater service than picking off lone infantrymen, and should be rewarded as such.One final thing, does the SAW overheat in 5 seconds IRL? I find it difficult to give supressive fire when my gun does more hissing than firing
I love this mod and only want to make it better. Keep up the good work
Of mankind we may say in general they are fickle, hypocritical, and greedy of gain. -Niccolò Machiavelli