Why do people like Muttrah?

[Heavy Death]

Comparing Muttrah to Justin Bieber is the most offensive comment I've ever seen to Muttrah

Ahaha

Was not meant in a bad way. But it really is way more successfull than it should be. Right time right place.

[mectus11]

I agree,

I always thought the docks should be all broken up into a series of smaller flags to bring the containers and ships into play.

Also, the castle a lot harder to penetrate rather than with all the options of the main entrance, helo drops, and ropes up the side.


We shall never know...

It's why we need fast ropes for helicopters.

[Matrox]

Muttrah is/was simply the greatest map ever created and played in PR...we ran it for 24/7 for 2 years straight...whomever created it should be awarded the PR map gold medal. I thank u sir....

Let's give a bit of background to the mappers.

When PR was developing maps within the dev team devs would develop a map and choke points on what they feel was right by looking at the editor,

Rhino would develop a map, create his own statics for realism and then play a round as each side to see how long it would take him to get to each flag to ensure it was balanced. It was because of Rhino's tenacity that Muttrah remains one of the most balanced maps compared to others. yes over time clans have realised how to make shortcuts and Server admins added rules which impacted game play but the core map and its overall natural feel was due to rhino's skill. The fact of tyhe matter is Muttrah was so successful thanks to Rhino's knowledge of gameplay, balance and assets which we haven't seen since.

[LEGIYA]

Muttrah is good for d**k players....

[parch]

Muttrah is good for d**k players....

Dank?
Dark?
DPRK?
Duck?

[Vista]

Its linear, its simple, its clean and its balanced.

This t b h

[Mouthpiece]

Its linear, its simple, its clean and its balanced.

Though as someone noted - the map needs some polish in a sense that the map needs more dirt, more burning stuff and more shit on the streets. It's a battlefield after all. But those are just secondary things that won't impact the core gameplay (infantry would feel safer in the streets knowing that enemy can fire from advantageous elevated position anytime - i'm talking about all the buildings).

But, yeah, as I said and Wing Walker agreed - map badly needs new flag layouts. Like, for example, two flags in docks so 2-3 sneaky infantry guys can't cap their last flag and deny their spawns so fast. I understand that our resident genius Rhino measured time/distance from all flags and from both team perspective, but maybe it can be mixed up a little and tested as an ALT version (by tested I mean that players could playtest it).

[Rabbit]

Though as someone noted - the map needs some polish in a sense that the map needs more dirt, more burning stuff and more shit on the streets. It's a battlefield after all. But those are just secondary things that won't impact the core gameplay (infantry would feel safer in the streets knowing that enemy can fire from advantageous elevated position anytime - i'm talking about all the buildings).

But, yeah, as I said and Wing Walker agreed - map badly needs new flag layouts. Like, for example, two flags in docks so 2-3 sneaky infantry guys can't cap their last flag and deny their spawns so fast. I understand that our resident genius Rhino measured time/distance from all flags and from both team perspective, but maybe it can be mixed up a little and tested as an ALT version (by tested I mean that players could playtest it).

Well I didn't mean clean in that way but yeah, that seems to be a common thing people say. I mean clean as in limited bugs and issues.

[Rhino]

Cheers for all the positive comments guys

Though as someone noted - the map needs some polish in a sense that the map needs more dirt, more burning stuff and more shit on the streets. It's a battlefield after all. But those are just secondary things that won't impact the core gameplay (infantry would feel safer in the streets knowing that enemy can fire from advantageous elevated position anytime - i'm talking about all the buildings).

While I agree the map needs more polish etc, the map isn't all destroyed and full of shell craters, burning car wrecks etc as I was wanting to portray an untouched city, with you being the first wave of a surprise attack on it (similar to the Battle of Inchon during the Korean War, but with choppers and other modern kit) and it isn't unheard of either for forces to hold back major firepower in/on a city in an attempt to preserve it (Battle of Hue for example, until the later stages of the battle when they eventually lifted the ban on heavy weapons and obliterated most of the city), where this also fits into my mini-storyline of the map since in it, the USMC are attempting to liberate the city from the MEC after the MEC captured Oman (MEC is largely, but not totally, based on Iranian armed forces for example).

But, yeah, as I said and Wing Walker agreed - map badly needs new flag layouts. Like, for example, two flags in docks so 2-3 sneaky infantry guys can't cap their last flag and deny their spawns so fast. I understand that our resident genius Rhino measured time/distance from all flags and from both team perspective, but maybe it can be mixed up a little and tested as an ALT version (by tested I mean that players could playtest it).

Ye I agree that the map kinda does need a new flag layout simply because the current has been played so many times over it has simply gotten stale. But I disagree in having a new flag layout just for the hell of it, the new one has to work just as well, if not better than the last in order to be truly worth changing it. So many maps in the past had decent flag layouts, then when random flags came in, ditched their established flag layout which worked well, for totally random flags (not the AAS routes etc we have now), and then most games you played on the map, you hardly ever had a decent/balanced flag layout, with the flags commonly giving one side a clear advantage, and the games being totally sh*t as a result. I would rather have a good/balanced, but old/stale flag setup than random/new and the game be one sided and sh*t.

I have plenty of ideas for changing the flag setup for Muttrah btw, but really in order to make them really work, the map needs changing and updating and until then, I don't feel its worth changing it much.

As for having multiple dock flags, one of the bigger problems with that is it slows down the USMC at the begging of the round a lot and leaves them much more venerable to rushing from being spread out thinly over docks, which if a rush works, slows them down even more, and could even result in a situation where they are never able to even break out of the docks at the begging of the round. While yes, there are things you can do to slow the MECs advance down a bit too, they are already slowed down quite a bit as it is without forcing all the guys initially spawning to walking to their first flag
So ye, map balancing is a delicate thing, especially when dealing with asymmetrical map balance like Muttrah and if you change one thing, it affects a whole heap of other things and then changing something else to counter the last change, affects other stuff and ye, takes quite a bit to get just right

[Jabil_One]

.... the map isn't all destroyed and full of shell craters, burning car wrecks etc as I was wanting to portray an untouched city, with you being the first wave of a surprise attack on it....

And now, we will get one day a ruined muttrah after (muttrah added in 200 9 years of massive PvP battles ?
I forgot to mention it is the first map that loads when our coop server =VG= crashed so muttrah city took the most colateral damage to its buildings.

Muttrah with sewage canals would be also a nice idea to reach some areas underground.

Muttrah ruined and everyone take position in big tshape ruined building and firing in other ruins is my biggest dream for muttrah.

Most funpart of muttrah is clearing the building interiours! CQB

[bahiakof]

OFFTOPIC
I love this map, it would be nice to recreate this same map for insurgency game mode. A new version in ruins due to the combat that occurred between conventional forces. Mosque and fortress semi destroyed by Hell Fires and artillery, craters and vehicles destroyed in the streets and damaged buildings. It would be very cool a version called "Ruins of Muttrah City" for insurgency game mode.

In this new map, the player would participate in the insurgent "uprising" against the American occupation forces in the city.

[Jabil_One]

Imaging,

sitting as squadie in a full manned trans huey and you see the ruined MUTTRAH scenery from distance.
Wrecks, fire, smoke, craters, ruins, roads are covered with whatever kind of debris (COVER) everywhere.
Insurgents sneaking through a complex sewage canalsystem to different areas of the map.
Current muttrah isn't big for an 2km map. A little bit more underground fight are also nice.
Muttrah is an important part of the Project Reality Mod History. Please continoue Muttrah's PR history.

[WeeGeez]

It brings out strategy, especially those T-buildings I agree its overplayed but it doesn't bother me.

[Spitfire1.2]

Maybe you could do a "Muttrah day 2". Where the US forces failed to capture the city in day 1, but they managed to setup an hq on docks. In my mind, after the fierce battle that had taken place in the previus day, the city would have been in ruins (much like Grozny).


This could be a way to try new things without altering the original map

[Rabbit]

Maybe you could do a "Muttrah day 2". Where the US forces failed to capture the city in day 1, but they managed to setup an hq on docks. In my mind, after the fierce battle that had taken place in the previus day, the city would have been in ruins (much like Grozny).


This could be a way to try new things without altering the original map

Tbh the only thing I really want to see is a reverse layer where either
A. US already landed in Oman and is headed down the coastal road with tanks, with naval air support from the carrier
B. Just flipped main, MEC is at the docks, normal layout otherwise.

[Mouthpiece]

Tbh the only thing I really want to see is a reverse layer where either
A. US already landed in Oman and is headed down the coastal road with tanks, with naval air support from the carrier
B. Just flipped main, MEC is at the docks, normal layout otherwise.

Yeah, it would be nice to see US in MEC base and MEC in docks. Maybe even switch up the factions a little bit and put in US ARMY or Canadians instead of Marines. And give each faction a tank or two. I understand Muttrah is far from a good tank battlefield, but people would really like it. Also, no attack choppers on the layouts with tanks so they at least can have some chance of survival.

[Heavy Death]

Or, OR, probably the least complicated suggestion - make it really overcast weather, darker, with ambient sounds of winds and the waves bashing on the city wall. You know, the type when you feel the cold spray from the sea on your uniform. Gritty, nasty, bad mood weather.

[Mouthpiece]

Yeah, bad weather sounds good on paper, but then US would be motre powerful then now as trans would roam freely w/o the APCs having a good chance to deny airspace.

[Heavy Death]

I meant bad weather more as in darker ambient, grey tones, cold etc. Didn't have reduced VD in mind.