the armed pilot, new solution (afaik)

[Elektro]

Make a Jet pilot kit and a Heli pilot kit .. Heli pilot is armed but has no parachute, while the jet pilot has a parachute but no weapon. Simple

[jbgeezer]

I think its a very nice idea, the only flaw is that if your chopper blows up, you dont have a PDW. And a jet pilot will never have the chance to pickup such a kit, in the event of a shootdown.

IRL pilots carry a PDW with them when they fly. I can perfectly understand why the PDW was removed from the pilot kit, but I really think you should remove the parachute completely from PR. There are very few jet maps, and usually when you are hit, then you are dead. Also we have no realistic eject system. And helo pilots dont jump in parachutes to get out if they are hit (exept the KA-50). They crashland instead. If the parachute was removed there would be no rambo paratroopers. SIMPLE

[rampo]

I think its a very nice idea, the only flaw is that if your chopper blows up, you dont have a PDW. And a jet pilot will never have the chance to pickup such a kit, in the event of a shootdown.

IRL pilots carry a PDW with them when they fly. I can perfectly understand why the PDW was removed from the pilot kit, but I really think you should remove the parachute completely from PR. There are very few jet maps, and usually when you are hit, then you are dead. Also we have no realistic eject system. And helo pilots dont jump in parachutes to get out if they are hit (exept the KA-50). They crashland instead. If the parachute was removed there would be no rambo paratroopers. SIMPLE

I have used my parachute in a number of occasions in PR while hopping out of a VERY heavily damaged jet(dontcha call me a bailer there was no way for me to save em

[killonsight95]

rampo has a good point there we all know pilots have parachutes in real life so thye should be in

[jbgeezer]

I have used my parachute in a number of occasions in PR while hopping out of a VERY heavily damaged jet(dontcha call me a bailer there was no way for me to save em

Yeah yeah, thats not the point. I'd rather have a realistic PDW system, than parachutes. Its like 1 ticket for your death. And there are like two jet maps in PR... And alot more helo maps. If we really need to have parachutes for jets, make separate kits (I know it has been suggested before)

-Helo pilot=guy without parachute, but with a PDW.
-Jet pilot=guy with parachute, but without a PDW.

rampo has a good point there we all know pilots have parachutes in real life so thye should be in

Helo pilots aint issued parachutes, but jet pilots do. They also have an ejector seat, that allows you to stand on the ground, but be ejected high enough for you parachute to open properly. Another thing that we dont have, and AFAIK will never have in PR, due to engine limitations.

[CodeRedFox]

Dr2B Rudd while you had a real new suggestion, this thread turning into every other "Why no weapons for pilots" banter.

[McBumLuv]

Dr2B Rudd while you had a real new suggestion, this thread turning into every other "Why no weapons for pilots" banter.

Because the age old question has yet to be answered

• The pistol-pilot squads were only really rampant in 0.8 when the pistol was the only weapon that wasn't FUBAR in CQC.
• Helicopters need to have their crash physics and such looked at to make survivable landings possible.
• You can't go on unrealistic paratrooping missions if none of the kits have parachutes.
• The ejector seat could technically be created in PR, but either a macro would be needed to simplify things, or players would need to click about three buttons in quick succession.
• Jet Pilots can have standard issue kits with them (including any sidearms) if their kit doesn't have a parachute, but the ejector seat does.

All this indicates that the removal of weapons was mainly due to the abnormal occurrence of "paratroopers" due to their ridiculous efficiency in 0.8. No one actually looked at the exact variables, and there's been no looking back for the most part.

[CodeRedFox]

Its been answered

[Marshall]

Why would the downed pilot not take grenadier, or HAT or whatever else was better than toting a pistol and some smoke grenades when he's managed to hit the chopper on the deck like a brick after being shot? Or is it a case of only the Pilot - PDW and Pilot kit be available from choppers?

PersonallyI say No, I'm all for pilots being unarmed. Fuck 'em, they should go solemnly down with their craft or keep it in the air and no grey area.

I find it somewhat funny and very immersive gameplay trying to stay alive as a downed pilot behind enemy lines with no weapon.

I make it sound like it happens a lot, well it happened once, on Ramiel, it was quite a buzz dodging enemies actually. If I had proper team co-ordination an LB, Hummer or APC would be straight there to rescue me. They weren't, so I stalked around until I could find an insurgent kit to take, carried on with an AK until I died.

Don't give pilots weapons, let's just "roleplay" that the damage in the aircraft caused fires that cooked off all available ammuniton of the PDW rendering it completely useless.

Yeah yeah, thats not the point. I'd rather have a realistic PDW system, than parachutes. Its like 1 ticket for your death. And there are like two jet maps in PR... And alot more helo maps. If we really need to have parachutes for jets, make separate kits (I know it has been suggested before)

It's, what 10? for an aircraft. Might as well be 11 I say, my AA kills go up to 11. In fact no, they start at 11 but can often be 15 or 16.

What use is a pilot on the ground anyway with our without pistol? With pistol is worse, this will encourage him to think "hmm I wonder if I can get any cheeky kills, let's find out" rather than "FUCK! I need to find a safe LZ and call in someone to rescue me" If he loses an aircraft he should want to and deserve to lose his life. He'll likely be alone, enemy he runs into will likely not be alone. They will have LMGs and rifles usually as a bare minimum.
Those Choppers are expensive, millions of pounds, we could train a 100 pilots for a fraction of it's cost.

No, for PR to stay realistic, pilots fulfil a role of keeping aircraft airborne and effective. Infantry do the handheld weaponry.

[Brummy]

Those Choppers are expensive, millions of pounds, we could train a 100 pilots for a fraction of it's cost.

uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuhhh.. really?

[CodeRedFox]

Look for any "Pilot need guns" thread. Should get one for each week.

[Nemus]

I think I found one:

https://www.realitymod.com/forum/f18-pr ... post974344

(And actually its the one which conviced me for this matter :mrgreen

[badmojo420]

Good suggestion Rudd. They could even just enable crewman kit requesting off helicopters.

[Gosu-Rizzle]

I appriciate the argument from the thread in the link. (The short of it is that the pilot should NEVER engage in combat and just let his teammates cover him) But i still dont see why you cant give the pilots (without parachuts) a pistol. Just let him have like 1 or 2 mags, that will surely make him think twice about engaging anything. I mean, there are lots of cases where the enemy will be closer then the friends trying to help you.. The hostiles WILL see you going down, and if they know you have absolutly nothing to deffend yourself with, untill help arrives, they dont even have to be carefull... they can just charge in and knife you ??:

[Mongolian_dude]

I feel that this over complicates things in terms of kits. Having two pilot kits, especially for new players would not appear very apparent, even to those who would read the manual. Also, it is especially hard to find the time to request a kit from an aircraft, when your meant to be creating distance between you and the heap of smouldering metal thats pissing jet-fuel.


----
I think a better method would be to drastically increase the pilots spawn time after death.
Now jumping into the fray is cost-ineffective for players, as they will then be forced to wait a long time to re spawn. There would be greater consequences for the pilot who goes down with his bird, or the '1337 paratrooper'; giving players the incentive to bail out and not just accept the doom of a failing warbird.

Then, it would make sense to arm pilots, as the weapon now really are their last ditch hope of making it out from enemy lines. Escape and Evasion would be preferable, as the risk of being discovered and hunted after firing is very high and should only be done when totally necessary.

Going down with your ship= 00:02:10
Capture and execution= 00:01:30

Team-kills of a pilot not mounted in a vehicle results in= 00:00:40 for the pilot
And an additional 00:01:00 for his killer, on death, to prevent escape of penalty through TKing; as well as reduce the impact of trouble-makers intentionally TKing to inflict larger spawn times on others

The TKing of two pilots within 3 minutes would result in an auto-suicide of the culprit and a 00:04:00 minute spawn time, to arrest those intentionally killing pilots are a carrier/airfield and allowing admins sufficient time to deal with them.

With such high risks involved, perhaps even a Personal Defence Weapon is justifiable for the pilot's inventory.
Additionally, it may also discourage those players who make it hard for their team by flying aircraft, simply because there are aircraft available and not because they are useful at that point.


...mongol...

[Silly_Savage]

Mongolian_dude;1148329']I feel that this over complicates things in terms of kits. Having two pilot kits, especially for new players would not appear very apparent, even to those who would read the manual. Also, it is especially hard to find the time to request a kit from an aircraft, when your meant to be creating distance between you and the heap of smouldering metal thats pissing jet-fuel.


----
I think a better method would be to drastically increase the pilots spawn time after death.
Now jumping into the fray is cost-ineffective for players, as they will then be forced to wait a long time to re spawn. There would be greater consequences for the pilot who goes down with his bird, or the '1337 paratrooper'; giving players the incentive to bail out and not just accept the doom of a failing warbird.

Then, it would make sense to arm pilots, as the weapon now really are their last ditch hope of making it out from enemy lines. Escape and Evasion would be preferable, as the risk of being discovered and hunted after firing is very high and should only be done when totally necessary.

Going down with your ship= 00:02:10
Capture and execution= 00:01:30

Team-kills of a pilot not mounted in a vehicle results in= 00:00:40 for the pilot
And an additional 00:01:00 for his killer, on death, to prevent escape of penalty through TKing; as well as reduce the impact of trouble-makers intentionally TKing to inflict larger spawn times on others

The TKing of two pilots within 3 minutes would result in an auto-suicide of the culprit and a 00:04:00 minute spawn time, to arrest those intentionally killing pilots are a carrier/airfield and allowing admins sufficient time to deal with them.

With such high risks involved, perhaps even a Personal Defence Weapon is justifiable for the pilot's inventory.
Additionally, it may also discourage those players who make it hard for their team by flying aircraft, simply because there are aircraft available and not because they are useful at that point.


...mongol...

[Konfusion2113]

a pilot could have a system similar to a civi with hands up, and the enemy will be charged with negative points for killing him.

[Hoboknighter]

Here's a much better idea: remove the pilot kit and make every heavy vehicle require a crewman kit (or at least heli's, jets could still pilot I guess). No more chutes, no more paratrooper problem. If the heli pilot crash lands and survives, he gets his gun, but no one can bail out now from 600 feet.

[Nemus]

Mongol has some good points but I think the long respawn times will be good for net surfing and not for player's behavior. But I agree that when you crash its hard to find the time for a kit request.

Except this I think that Budd's idea is very good and worths some testing.

One more solution could be to restrict pilot kits requests to once per player.
You lost your pilot kit? You cant request an other for the rest of the round.
This way we can give to pilots a pistol with one clip.

You killed an enemy and picked up his kit? Good work. But you can't fly anymore.

You died? Bad luck. Let somebody else to try. Many people wants to fly you know.

Someone picks up a kit for you and "sacrifies" his turn? Well somebody likes you. You are a known or a good pilot (or you play with a friend) You deserve one more try.

You dont want to be a ground trooper and you want only to fly? I think you picked up a wrong game.