Project Reality Forums

karambaitos wrote:our eyes see at 25 or 27 FPS

Well that depends on lighting and contrast and much more. See: Frame rate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Helicopters in the BF2 engine are flatly unrealistic and feel as if they carry no inertia. It is far more dangerous in PR to pitch down steeply than it would be in real life, as you wouldn't be suddenly accelerating to max speed.

The helicopters are pretty easy to pick up, they just take some time to really become an expert.

Just because one person cannot fly and complains about it, doesn't mean the behaviour of all the helicopters needs to be overhauled. I mean, of course every single game is going to portray them differently, if you want them to be real, go play a flightsim like DCS: Black Shark

I will say that the behaviour of wheeled helicopters (Chinook, BH, Cow) as opposed to helicopters with skids (Huey) is rather frustrating. I find that the Chinook, BH and Cow are disabled far too easily if you bump into terrain (particularly the nose of the BH).
But what I'm really getting at is the "sliding" of the helicopters, which is more noticeable on the Cow where it slides across the terrain and eventually flips. It's hard to describe

Personally I'm okay with the wheeled helos, far more forgiving over rough terrain than skid based equivalents.

At least it means that if you land and there's a jagged terrain object, you aren't going to flip and explode.

Ford_Jam wrote:The helicopters are pretty easy to pick up, they just take some time to really become an expert.

Just because one person cannot fly and complains about it, doesn't mean the behaviour of all the helicopters needs to be overhauled. I mean, of course every single game is going to portray them differently, if you want them to be real, go play a flightsim like DCS: Black Shark

I will say that the behaviour of wheeled helicopters (Chinook, BH, Cow) as opposed to helicopters with skids (Huey) is rather frustrating. I find that the Chinook, BH and Cow are disabled far too easily if you bump into terrain (particularly the nose of the BH).
But what I'm really getting at is the "sliding" of the helicopters, which is more noticeable on the Cow where it slides across the terrain and eventually flips. It's hard to describe

I know exactly what you mean. If you land a Cow, even if it's perfectly horizontal, you -will- flip over if you do not take off again virtually immediately after touchdown and dropping off your passengers. It's just silly. This problem also exists with the Huey, where you just flip over if you land. Don't bother attempting to straighten out the helo once you notice it's toppling. Hop out and save your ***, because it's going to come down on you in seconds.

It might just be me, but I also cannot fly a helo with a joystick. It's not that I have a cheap or crappy one that is out of alignment or whatever. It's a X52 Pro from Saitec. When I press the stick half a centimeter to the side, the chopper will go and bank so much, that it's almost impossible to straighten out, and you start looking like an idiot in the air, untill you eventually crash into something.

I do know that it takes a while to get to know how to fly, and I think I got it under control, except for the banking and sometimes the sudden inability to pull up from a >35 degree downwards angle. Then again, it might just be me.

Nixy23 wrote:I know exactly what you mean. If you land a Cow, even if it's perfectly horizontal, you -will- flip over if you do not take off again virtually immediately after touchdown and dropping off your passengers. It's just silly. This problem also exists with the Huey, where you just flip over if you land. Don't bother attempting to straighten out the helo once you notice it's toppling. Hop out and save your ***, because it's going to come down on you in seconds.

It might just be me, but I also cannot fly a helo with a joystick. It's not that I have a cheap or crappy one that is out of alignment or whatever. It's a X52 Pro from Saitec. When I press the stick half a centimeter to the side, the chopper will go and bank so much, that it's almost impossible to straighten out, and you start looking like an idiot in the air, untill you eventually crash into something.

I do know that it takes a while to get to know how to fly, and I think I got it under control, except for the banking and sometimes the sudden inability to pull up from a >35 degree downwards angle. Then again, it might just be me.

Just been playing with the helos offline in PR for about an hour trying to get the hang of them. I don't think I've even tried the vanilla BF2 ones so I can't compare but I can manage to fly the helos in ArmA2OA and DCS BS2 with my joystick OK.

In BF2 PR, I first tried with the mouse and W/S for throttle taking off from an aircraft carrier (was just the first map I saw with helos) and spent most of the time diving into the sea shortly after taking off. I just watched a video on YT which said you have to wait 1-2mins for the engines to get to full power before taking off though, so that was probably the problem there. I don't think there's any indicator to show when it's ready though.

Then I moved to Kashan Desert. One thing I found confusing is the torgue indicator drops to 0 when releasing W so I thought there must be something wrong with my controls or something was pressing S, as I expected W/S to control the collective which should stay where it's set but when I released W the helo would fall back to the ground. I seem to have to keep holding W if I want to fly forward without also losing altitude, or actually keep tapping it as I ascend too much if I hold it. That may be due to not waiting long enough for the engines to get up to full power as well, although it still seems to do it to a certain extent even if I do wait.

I also tried using my Xbox360 controller and Thrustmaster Hotas X joystick to fly but didn't have much luck, whether I mapped the axis in PR, used Xpadder to map the stick to the mouse, or used Xpadder to map the keys to the controllers (I added the arrow keys to control pitch and bank in PR and then mapped the arrow keys to the stick).

Partly the problem will be down to the sensitivity settings/DPI in PR and for my mouse/joystick. There's not actually any sensitivity settings in Xpadder with the stick mapped to the mouse, rather horizontal and vertical Emulation Speed settings plus it can be set to Look/Camera, Mouse or Spring. If I map the axis directly in PR, I disable the stick in Xpadder so it's not affecting the input in any way then.

In PR, I reduced the Helo mouse sensitivity from 3.0 to 2.0 and that's made it easier to fly with the mouse. I still seem to keep getting into a steep bank that I can't recover from, causing me to crash sideways into the ground though! Yaw and Pitch Factor are set to 1.0 (I don't know what effect these would have) and Invert is enabled. It doesn't seem that there's any way to adjust the axis sensitivity in PR, so I guess the only way to adjust the joystick is to map it to the mouse and then use the mouse sensitivity settings in PR.

I had a few goes with the planes as well but their so fast I'm going off the map and getting suicided before I can manage to turn the thing around

EDIT: Forgot to mention that with the arrow keys mapped to pitch/bank it was impossible to fly using them, as they seem to give far too much input even with a short tap, so mapping the stick to the arrow keys isn't going to work either. I'll have another go with the stick mapped to the mouse and play with the mouse settings in Xpadder sometime.

Average warm up time is usually 30 seconds. The indicator is the sound that the main rotor makes. When it sounds like its at full speed you're usually good.

Steeps5 wrote:Average warm up time is usually 30 seconds. The indicator is the sound that the main rotor makes. When it sounds like its at full speed you're usually good.

Ah OK, seems the bloke in the video was wrong to say we should wait a further one to two minutes then.

doveman wrote:Ah OK, seems the bloke in the video was wrong to say we should wait a further one to two minutes then.

Nah, he was right. You can fly after 30 seconds, BUT you will have problems maneuvering the chopper. After 1-2 minutes the engine will be fully heated up and you can make your barrel rolls with your huey.

Please just dont join public servers if you dont know how to fly, (well u can still join the russian ones ) because ive seen alot of ppl trying to fly different helos and crash them all the time.
Learn the basics with the huey, join any server thats playing muttrah or jabal and do your job

btw humans see in 60fps

Microwaife wrote:Nah, he was right. You can fly after 30 seconds, BUT you will have problems maneuvering the chopper. After 1-2 minutes the engine will be fully heated up and you can make your barrel rolls with your huey.

Hmm, conflicting advice, not sure which to believe now. If it's true, it's a pain when learning as together with respawn time, it adds up to about 3mins wait every time I takeoff and crash almost immediately (whether due to poor flying or the controls not being set right yet), which isn't helpful. Would be useful if there was some sort of training mode that would let us skip the respawn, getting the pilot kit and waiting for the engines to warm up. Maybe even start us in the cockpit with the helo ready to go.

In ArmA I can just plonk a helo down in the editor with myself as pilot already in it and then it's only a few seconds to get the rotors up to speed and I can takeoff and practice.

Inspektura43 wrote:Please just dont join public servers if you dont know how to fly,

Aw, not even as infantry? Might be a while before I can join then

They are training versions of maps, Merk used to run server with it, but I didn't saw it for some time. You can also use debug mode to spawn helicopter instantly, as well as spawn yourself instantly.

Check this thread for more info. You will need rcon spawner and rcon ready commands.

Moszeusz6Pl wrote:They are training versions of maps, Merk used to run server with it, but I didn't saw it for some time. You can also use debug mode to spawn helicopter instantly, as well as spawn yourself instantly.

Check this thread for more info. You will need rcon spawner and rcon ready commands.

Cool, thanks. That'll help a lot, especially being able to spawn a new helo after I've crashed them all

I guess if anyone has the training maps I could run them on my own local server.

You can use Test Airfield for basic flying training. It have all air assets, with shorter spawn time. You can download it here

Nice one, thanks.

Inspektura43 wrote:btw humans see in 60fps

The human eye / brain combination can see well over 100 frames per second and thus far the limits have not thoroughly been tested yet. Suffice it to say, IT IS NOTHING LIKE THE 24, 30, 60 or even 100 fps ****, that gets spouted on the Internet.

Source.

My eyes see with over 9000 fps

Just kidding its funny that everyone seems to know the quick answer to this though. I guess those people who think our eyes are fixed on the standard movie format (24 fps) can save there money on the 3D 48 fps version of "The Hobbit"

and btw. the world is not seen in fps, ... the world hasn't turned to "Surrogates" state yet.

saXoni wrote:The human eye / brain combination can see well over 100 frames per second and thus far the limits have not thoroughly been tested yet. Suffice it to say, IT IS NOTHING LIKE THE 24, 30, 60 or even 100 fps ****, that gets spouted on the Internet.

Source.

oh damn

u got me here

BF2 chopper handling is the best I ever experienced.

ArmA 2 choppers physics are 100% unrealistic, cuz to move forward arma chopper has to tilt nose down to 90 degrees, the same to slow down, 90 degrees nose up - from aside it looks ridiculously stupid. Never seen to chopper fly like that in real life.