Project Reality Forums

Example:

APC is left about 250 meters away from the cappable flag. I move in on the opposite flank from the other squad who has laid down a rallypoint and put another one hidden from prying eyes close as I can to the flag.

Standing order: If rallypoint is exposed, everybody spawn at APC and wait untill we all head out again. I stay back and try to hide right on top of the flag.

My elemental math is now: Spawnpoints = Mainbase, APC, RP and me.

Sorry to all of you officer kit fans, but I have to agree, the officer kit does seem to be quite unnecessary. I'm usually stuck on the team that barely uses them. The only squad on my team that does use them effectively is full, and the other team with all or most of its squads is full, I cannot switch over to the other team thanks to auto-balance, so the "solution" of switching to other team is not an option. Making a squad sounds like an ideal solution to the problem, but unfortunately, you have to have a minimum number of people on your squad to use the rally points, and most people are in another squad or in those solo squads which do nothing for the team. I'm not going to lie, part of me wonders if the whole rally point business is more trouble than it's worth, most of my time is spent hoofing it to the battle, by myself, since my squad is somewhere across the map where there is no nearby spawn points. Perhaps if we made more things spawn points, such as the helicopters, rather than just the main base, APCs, rally points and squad leaders.

SevenOfDiamonds wrote:Read the Wiki. Learn to play. Get Experience. You will have no problems.

Sorry, no where in the Wiki could I find a why it is a good idea to make a really important part of the game unnecessarily complex. Perhaps you could explain, o' PR guru.

Having helo's act as spawn points would basically break the game as half of your and the enemies forces would be airborne (and most likely crashing into trees).

Ehh..good point, I could see myself spawning into a copter just when the pilot bailed out, and within a second, find what's left of myself in a tree. But still, the rally point system does need a few tweaks.

SevenOfDiamonds wrote:Read the Wiki. Learn to play. Get Experience. You will have no problems.

If it was a SOLO game it would work this way, but its not, it’s a team game. Its not a pro team, a club team, a school team or even little league, its a team made up of individuals of tremendously varying abilities, knowledge and inclinations. At any given time you will be playing a game with 50% of people who know quite well what they are doing ‘for the team’ and 50% who do not know or who do not care. Create a spambot that spits out ‘Read the Wiki’ a 100 times a game, it still wont work. There is no magical way to excise this 50% out of a game world except via the use of closed servers. Even building a game on the premise that people will ‘shed’ from the game world if they don’t enjoy it does not allow for people who enjoy playing the game ‘differently’ and more simply then how it was designed to be played by the developers, nor does it do anything about new player turnover adding chaos into a stable game world.

Your says that getting an idea from the Wiki is wrong? Then your saying that learning how to play the game by playing the game is wrong?? THEN you say that getting experince isn't going to work?! ... What is happening here ...?

Its common sense to learn how to do things before you do them ... but then again that was before common sense died.

Oh and a way not to make it complex is DONT DIE (And since that is impossible ... Get the Kit ... put the Ralley Point SOMEWHERE... ANYWHERE ... Then if you die you won't be at the main and it is as simple as making a move command)

SevenOfDiamonds wrote:Your says that getting an idea from the Wiki is wrong? Then your saying that learning how to play the game by playing the game is wrong?? THEN you say that getting experince isn't going to work?! ... What is happening to the world ...?

Its common sense to learn how to do things before you do them ... but then again that was before common sense died.

Oh and a way not to make it complex is DONT DIE (And since that is impossible ... Get the Kit ... put the Ralley Point SOMEWHERE... ANYWHERE ... Then if you die you won't be at the main and it is as simple as making a move command)

No, I am saying that the current iteration of the spawning experiment has shown some problems that need addressing.
The RPs are great, as they force players to join squads. But the deployment of the RPs needs work.

No, he saying that constantly saying to just read the wiki to solve all noob problems is not always going to work, since a good deal of the community just doesn't care enough to read it.

Oh and a way not to make it complex is DONT DIE (And since that is impossible ... Get the Kit ... put the Ralley Point SOMEWHERE... ANYWHERE ... Then if you die you won't be at the main and it is as simple as making a move command)

Well the problem is, making a squad, then getting the min. number of people to join it, to get the officer kit is easier said than done, since you still got your "lone wolf" people from vBF2, who refuse to join a squad, and people who are already in a squad. If this rally point and officer kit business must stay, at least decrease the number of people you need in a squad to use the RP.

If uneducation is the problem of leaders not placing rally points, maybe the devs should replace that EA advertisement at BF2 startup with a "Did you know" dialog, revealing important information for people not reading the guide.

ayjazz, DrMcCleod

Both of those problems are sovled with either 1. Find a better server. (team switching is pretty gay unless its to the team with less *yeah you people who switch to the better team are very gay and if you want to argue about your manhood PM me*) 2. Prove to everyone on your team that you CAN lead a squad into hell and manage to make it out. Then you will be able to get what you need and want. Till then all I can say is your SOL.

I understand what you guys are talking about because I felt this way about aspects of the game, but you will get used to it and will learn how to compensate.

SevenOfDiamonds wrote:
I understand what you guys are talking about because I felt this way about aspects of the game, but you will get used to it and will learn how to compensate.

I note that no-one in this thread has yet provided a good reason for limiting RP deployment to those SLs with Officer Kits, given the current limitations with what is moddable.

StrkTm MurderCityDevil wrote:Because PR puts a premium on EVERYTHING...I bet at some point you said to yourself, "geez, these spawn times really suck" until you realised this was done to make life very valuable.

I believe the same is true for squad leaders who are such an important part of how the battle plays out due to the amount of responsibility they have. These rally points and officer kits should not be turned into a lock squad of one so some moron can set a an RP and request a sniper rifle from it.

A knowledgable SL leading a full squad into postion to control a portion of the map is what these tools where intended for...not people who cant manage to get a sqaud of 4 people going and remember to request the kit at the correct places or die before before placing it.

Then you will find playing on a public server a frustrating experience.

On a game-by-game basis on good servers as a squad member I spawn more in an APC than at a Rally Point. This is not by choice, its because I dont have a Rally Point to spawn at. On a game-by-game basis the reason I dont get to spawn at a Rally Point is because the squad leader has not put one down. On a game-by-game basis I see the squads that have leaders who put down Rally points are always full, so I cant join a ‘better’ squad.

StrkTm MurderCityDevil wrote:Another misinformed statement...please come play with us on [PIT] .5 ABR later today and think this will all be cleared up for you.

Oh, I am sure that Clan Servers will manage to work around this awkward system, and have the RPs working as intended. But there is no good reason to leave the system as is.
I understand your Premium arguments, but you must acknowledge that there are limits to Premiums. Jamming weapons would detract from gameplay for example. Removing the unrealistic medics would detract from teamplay. The current Officer Kit system also detracts from teamplay and should be removed until it is possible to force SLs to spawn with the OK by default.

SevenOfDiamonds wrote:ayjazz, DrMcCleod

Both of those problems are sovled with either
1. Find a better server....
2. Prove to everyone on your team that you CAN lead a squad...

Find a better server.

Got a roadmap for that? Better server because of better players? That means a clan server, anyone who would put forward a public server as being better than another public server is stoking ego

As for number 2…. HUH? There is a difference between wanting to be a squad leader and wanting to be in a squad that works. What Ayjazz, DrMcCloud and myself are agitating for is to make the job EASIER for the squad leader so that the game curve is not so steep that they hang themselves and, by default, their entire squad as well.

Now, me, I have the smarts to make and lead a squad but I have serious Mic/VOIP problems I cant get to the bottom of, it would be impossible to SL without a mic. However some good players don’t want to be good squad leaders anyway, they want to follow, not lead, so telling them ‘if you think you can do a better job then do it yourself’ is realy meaningless.