Sniper Kit Discussion - Removal?

[Ts4EVER]

Well teamplay is good and all, but after all PR is also about fun, and the devs put in the sniper kits so people use them and have fun with them. Of course, if they drive away with important assets that sucks, but not liking snipers because they are arguably less team oriented is wrong imo. See it from this perspective: Snipers also create tactical situations for a squad to solve and a certain satisfaction when they are finally hunted down. They are an aspect that enrichens the game.

[Snazz]

I don't hate snipers and I don't mind them being in an infantry squad (upto SL).

I reckon most players would hate snipers because they're used to seeing bad snipers, or they're just plain jerks like that guy who ran you over and tk'd you.

Like most specialized/powerful kits and assets in PR, the sniper kit can be used effectively or wasted.

Due to the apparent lack of skill/knowledge/team-orientation witnessed, the sniper kit itself has gained a bad reputation.

Fair enough if that's what is happening most of the time, just remember it's the people who use it not the kit itself that is the problem.

I wouldn't mind the sniper kit being replaced by an improved marksman (designator, better rifle accuracy and damage), as it'd make more sense to have them integrated with infantry squads.

[Conman51]

i dont hate good snipers..only bad ones..and ones that join my infantry squads and say "oh im good with it i can live in a fire fight" and they end up being the first one dead in CQC

[freeway]

some of u above said who wants sniper kit spends 3/4 of the time doing nothing why dont defend cache or attack them ? u r wrong , ppl like me we love that kit so we wait 4 it rather than TK some1 to get it , we all play PR for main reasons fun and reality , so to us sniping is THE fun it is just as simple as yours , u cant tell us how to enjoy the game , like me i like the lee enfield so much i could wait for it 20 mins . i sometimes dont have many kills and most of the time i walk all over the map to get a good spot but i enjoy it . if i am in your sq i ll do whatever u want me to , i understand that the point i am trying to tell is ppl play their game and you play yours , let them have fun .
- some1 above said sniper is a useless kit in insurgency role , u r right and wrong . u r right because the lee enfield has it limit at 180 meters so compair to the us or british 1 it is piece of sh*t ( i gess this is y i dont have to wait for it most of the time ) and u r wrong because it is so lethal and deadly if u could make it around 600 - 700 meters as i do . in archer i could cover 700 meters around me which is as good as us sniper , and in korengal i cover whole map and i mean i could kill a guy laying down at 700 meters with lee enfield . i dont know much about ppl but i enjoy the lee enfield , it is the hardest gun in PR to shoot , due to huge bullet drop very few ammo , long time reload and it requires SKILLS . if u dont believe me go ahead try it see if u could hit anything at 300 meters with it . i am saying is respect ppl , u have fun being SL or gunman or pilot so do i as a sniper . some ppl are good some bad that makes the game fun , we ll learning

[ralfidude]

freeway just keeps missing the point...

[Kirra]

to increase their efectiveness even more

if you're shooting at bots- yes, when you have average squad(not eveen talking about good), pop some smoke, get direction of incoming fire, supress and kill sniper

Problem is that when the sniper is 400 meters away, you don't know where he is shooting from. Its very hard to figure that out and by the time you do 4-6 people will already be dead.


Just ask the guys that were on the Taliban side on T&T on Korengal this evening if they had some issues with snipers on that map while attacking the Outpost flag. It took them over 30 minutes to figure our that they were not getting killed from Outpost, but from a hilltop east of it. And that was after they capped the flag.

And the guy sniping them was only 200 meters away from them.

[maxkill42]

I have yet to find a handful of snipers that are accually useful to the team and dont just try and go rambo

[Nemus]

i like the lee enfield so much i could wait for it 20 mins .

You just gave answer to your first's post question:
"Why ppl hate snipers so much"

In 20 minutes you could help your teammates with a medikit, an ammo bag, one extra rifle or whatever.
But you prefer to stay and waiting for 20 minutes just for the sniper kit.

Its your right. I cant tell you how to play and enjoy the game. But dont ask why ppl hates you.
You dont care about your teammates. You care for your sniper rifle.
So why your teammates must like you?

Simple...

[GoArmy117]

I've only been a sniper twice, and I must say that both times I helped a good deal.

The first time was on Muttrah and I was in a sniper squad. The squad leader and I has snipers and we had another member who was out spotter/medic. We stayed on the hilltops to the west for the entire round (as MEC) never dying. We cleared out several squads, dodged APCs and Helis, and generally just held the enemy back as much as we could.

The second time I can't remember what the name of the map was but we were fighting Russians I think. Anyways, before the round, my squad leader was assigning kits and said he wanted one sniper. No one else volunteered, so I did. We spawned, I got the kit, and we moved out. We came up on a compound and my SL set a rally in a ditch. Suddenly an APC can around and started nailing us. I was able to hide, but the rest of my squad was killed. They spawned further away from me at a firebase. I set up shop on a hill top and watched the compound. The enemy started to build a firebase, and I called its position in to my squad. I asked permission to engage the targets, and my squad leader gave it to me. I took a couple shots and killed 2 people. I moved position after those shots to cover my squad, who were moving into the compound. I called enemy positions in and was even able to cover my squad's back from a couple people.

I agree that most people do abuse the sniper kit, but it is a VERY effective tool when used correctly.

[ralfidude]

Guys STOP IT, ur going around saying the same thing over and over as everybody else said already, that doesnt answer the question, just gives ur input about snipers in general.


You are missing the point, We only hate BAD snipers, and the kind of snipers that get their kits in a way that serves NO purpose to the team, like wasting 20 minutes trying to get it, or joining squad just for kit then leaving, or grabbing vehicles and leaving them just for urself.

SLs dont want snipers, they want soldiers in the field.

CAS squads require Snipers for lazing, althought SL position is recommended in case you get killed and lose ur sniper kit to enemy.


THATS IT.


The answer is summed up right there.

Some of you are going off talking abut the same thing everybody else said that doesnt actually reffered to the question he asked.




PS: Not saying you should stop this thread, but get back on topic giving reasons answering the question.

[Psyko]

freeway just keeps missing the point...

actually his side of it is valid too. He plays PR for fun, remember? fun? that thing? it makes you happy? FUUUUUN. (ok i'v made my point ) Not for necessity. WHich is the right way to do it.

But Also, its unfortunite that sniper people deliberatly play it in a selfish fashion. I know from experiance with a couple of clan members we used to have. They run around on their own, beeing L337 and not communicating. and even though sometimes we might say, hey dude, why dont you help us out here with some sniper support...most times, they will run off and wont even go near your AO and not speak to you for a half hour.

[Kushluk]

@ Freeway.

It is people like you who destroy pr for the rest of us. We need teamwork not snipers.

[unrealalex]

Some PR players hate snipers because they aren't the ones with the kit. And when a sniper does bad, 99% of the time the player thinks "What a noob! I could have done better! I deserve that kit! This pisses me off so much I'm gona go complain on the forums!"

If you're not convinced, consider this. What's the difference between a bad rifleman and a bad sniper if each is 0-1? There is no difference. The death is still only one ticket lost. You don't see anyone complaining about bad riflemen do you?

There is still plenty of teamwork even with 2 snipers on each team. Stop whining people jeez. You say snipers destroy pr for the rest of us? I say you destroy PR for the rest of us with your whining for things to be simplified and made idiot-proof.

[Rudd]

If you're not convinced, consider this. What's the difference between a bad rifleman and a bad sniper if each is 0-1? There is no difference. The death is still only one ticket lost. You don't see anyone complaining about bad riflemen do you?

not quite

if you lose the rifleman kit to the enemy, its annoying since then its harder to tell what is enemy fire

if you lose the sniper kit to the enemy, you might actually lose it to som1 who knows what they are doing.

Thus, the enemy's long range capacity is vastly increased, which is more than annoying, it can get whole squads killed.

Thus bad snipers can get whole squads killed

its as bad as losing a HAT kit.

[Snazz]

Lol Rudd, you can use that formula to make almost anything in PR look bad.

Guys STOP IT, ur going around saying the same thing over and over as everybody else said already, that doesnt answer the question, just gives ur input about snipers in general.

Welcome to internet forums, a place where you can discuss things as opposed to strictly Q&A.

If the OP doesn't want discussion that's their call.

[SARCASM]

actually his side of it is valid too. He plays PR for fun, remember? fun? that thing? it makes you happy? FUUUUUN. (ok i'v made my point ) Not for necessity. WHich is the right way to do it.

What? Other people's fun? Pfft!

PR is about "teamwork", which means everyone else does what I want them to regardless of what they consider fun.

If they don't they're all just vanilla bf2 1337 hacking noobs and don't deserve to play.

@ Freeway.

It is people like you who destroy pr for the rest of us. We need teamwork not snipers.

Yeah! You've destroyed PR!

We can't have teamwork AND snipers, they're complete polar opposites...

[/SARCASM]

[Remoted-Bomb]

well, i do enjoy sniping when you're in a 2 man team. Sneaking and taking out peoples on the way. in EJOD, we once swiped over the whole eastern side. We could also report about enemy contact to the tanks and let them take it our. It's part of recon. Since they can monitor huge areas, you can focus on other aspects of the battlefield.

But, as probarly already said, uberboy1337 don't like to crawl. No, we need sniper or we will die, so i run now. And he gets killed. You need big patience because it can take 30 minutes to get 100 meters forward. In vanilla, you can just take a Black Hawk and paradrop from it, and then you're there. Takes 30 seconds.

From what i've know, i think sniper is one of the most "psychical" since you need alot of patience. Which only the hardcore PR-gamers have, mostly. Which not is the typical sniper in PR (or sometimes, but not often)

[Demonic]

actually his side of it is valid too. He plays PR for fun, remember? fun? that thing? it makes you happy? FUUUUUN. (ok i'v made my point ) Not for necessity. WHich is the right way to do it.

It's alright to have fun, but not if your fun conflicts with everybody elses fun. You can still have the same fun by creating/joining a purely sniper/recon squad operating with another guy or by yourself. You don't require to join infantry squads and take sniper without asking to have fun neither do you have to be sniper to have that fun. If a sniper squad is already full than join a infantry squad and forget being sniper for a map.

Most people are selfish with kits and don't care about anybody else or there ability to have fun. I have even seen people TK somebody for taking a sniper kit regardless of the fact the dude was in a sniper squad and the TKer was in a infantry squad but originally requested a marksman kit and lost it.

His side is not valid at all. The fact of the matter is when people create squads they have expectations. They want a full on infantry squad to go with them and help them build firebases or take objectives. In most peoples mind that doesn't include a sniper as all they do is stay behind and pick people off. They can be a good asset if the sniper is a good shooter however he is not valuable to a infantry squad. He can as easily create/join a sniper squad and give the team the same support and allow his slot to be filled in that infantry squad by a medic, riflemen specialist, AR, AT, LAT, AA, Grenadier, etc. Anything that would much more benefit a squad in there objectives.

[DankE_SPB]

...

ever heard about paragraphs and spelling?


btw

AKA AlexanderK-47

AKA =RRF=AlexanderK-47

WTF

@Kirra
i wrote answer to you, but it got pwned by my browser and i'm too lazy to write it again

[Wicca]

Allright. People play PR for fun, and thats why they double click that image of PR on their desktop.

Fun, i think that word really needs to be used a bit more differently. Why do i play PR?

So that i can have fun? Yes.

Do i have fun just because i spawned and now im happy?

No.. I have to be in a given situation, like leading a squad, being part of a team, calling airstrikes, surviving an attack, being part of an awesome engagement. Taking RPG fire.

Stuff that wouldnt happend if there was no teamwork. Thats why, for me, teamwork = fun.

And snipers = no teamwork, cause teamwork is all about finding needs and filling them, there is absolutely no need to stay at main base waiting for a kit. NEVER!!!!!!

EVER EVER!

Just like during a firefight, you see the new players instead of being part of perhaps a squad coohesion and firefight plan, when we have suppressed the enemy they leave their post and starts walking towards the enemy.

So, in fact if sniper kits was removed id be happy. Besides, its not even realistic, having people using the sniper kit the way they are now! Its alot better if the devs implement something that will enable the players to work more coohesivly togheter, rather than having thos extra pieces of mb in the mod, use that for something else.

Now, i know some of you are good with a sniper kit, and that you dont play it cause you enjoy it but since its needed. But thats really rare.

Usually when im on a server, i want to think, what can i do to help my team?
Some people say, I WANT HUEY! or I WANT ATTACK CHOPPER!

And well, sometimes that actually ends in Tks etc, since there is more than 2 people going for that role.

Now if people would play PR, and instead of seeing what they want, but what the team needs, they would enjoy the game a whole lot more, and so would everyone else.

[MrSh@vid]

Now if people would play PR, and instead of seeing what they want, but what the team needs, they would enjoy the game a whole lot more, and so would everyone else.

To true Wicca.