New VIP Gamemode makeover using current maps

[=HCM= Shwedor]

I have been playing this mod for 5+ years now and I have also seen a high number of complaints about the insurgency gamemode, and thus I propose the introduction of a VIP gamemode. A new twist on the old and great gamemode, designed to introduce a new level of teamwork. This gamemode is highly suited for recent PR developments, such as mumble. It is oriented towards infantry combat, instead of vehicle combat like Kashan(which has become unpopular as of late). I have gone about for the past few months creating an example plan for what a VIP mode would look like using the Al-Basrah map as a basis. I believe that many other PR maps have the potential to be utilized for a VIP gamemode as well. This, along with my questioning of a number of regular PR players, has led me to believe the VIP gamemode should be reintroduced in some form or another.

Example List of changes from basic insurgency Al-Basrah to a VIP Al-Basrah:

1. Artillery IED for insurgents removed (don't want to make it too easy)

2. SPG Technical for insurgents removed

3. Gary for insurgents removed (and Big Red)

4. Challenger 2 Tank for British removed

5. All but one Warrior for British removed (total of one warrior on map)

6. Scimitar(s) removed

7. Addition of Panther CLV's to replace the Warriors that are to be removed

8. Addition of more .50 cal armed Rovers

9. Removal of the helicopters for British

10. Sapper (IED) kit limited for insurgents, one per a squad of 4+. Maybe limit the number of mines per a kit to 1 or 2.

11. Removal of C4 (replace with SLAM timer detonated explosives) , Heavy Anti-Tank, and AA kits for British (a la SAW removal on Matrox's fun maps)

12. Decreased number of 50 cal technicals

13. Removal of caches/insurgency gamemode, replace with AAS style flags at VCP, gas station and Palace, capped in the order of VCP first, gas station second, then Palace. Only the VIP can cap (a la like pilots can't cap flags) (extra flags can be added. Reason: to encourage ambushing tactics, and attempt to prevent players from wandering off into the boondocks)

14. Addition of the old SUV from previous PR versions, for VIP usage only. Respawns 5 minutes after death. Only able to be driven using a VIP kit.

15. VIP kit (only a basic PDW armament to prevent rambo VIP), only one for British team (limited) (maybe have it allocated only to the commander or as a single ground spawn kit to only reappear after VIP death and have the kit of the dead VIP instantly disappear)

16. British ticket count set to 500, Insurgent ticket count set to 950

17. Removal of Supply trucks (No British Firebases, want them to use convoys and not to repair the VIP vehicle)

18. Addition of more civilian vehicles for insurgents, respawning. (all in insurgent main where bomb cars/gary/big red spawn) (original civi cars from insurgency mode to remain spread around)

19. Removal of Bomb cars

20. Add extra RPG kits in insurgent main (total of 6 for insurgents)

21. Add extra SVD kits in insurgent main (total of 2 for insurgents)

22. Add extra Enfield Sniper kits in insurgent main (total of 2 for insurgents)

23. Addition of Three troop trucks for British.

24. Add 6 RPK's and 4 PKM's in insurgent main

25. Add 2 ironsights enfield rifles in insurgent main

26. Add 2 extra ammo technicals in insurgent main (total of 4)


Keep in mind, this gamemode would require some basic server rules to support it. Such as requiring the VIP to remain in the VIP car. It is a basic sketch, not an extremely detailed plan because there is so much more that can be done with this and the creative people out there will surely find flaws and possible additions to it. Maybe if the PSC faction gets off the ground it can be even more realistic looking.

[=HCM= Shwedor]

Bump!

Comments on proposed VIP Escort game mode welcomed!

[_Fizzco_]

Keep in mind, this gamemode would require some basic server rules to support it. Such as requiring the VIP to remain in the VIP car.

This is the biggest issue here imo, It just simply will not work on public servers, nobodys going to want to be forced to remain inside a vehicle and be driven around, some might but not many. This type of thing is best suited to events (similar to the one that was part of the OD-S Zombie event)

[=HCM= Shwedor]

This is the biggest issue here imo, It just simply will not work on public servers, nobodys going to want to be forced to remain inside a vehicle and be driven around, some might but not many. This type of thing is best suited to events (similar to the one that was part of the OD-S Zombie event)

The VIP won't be driven around, he will be driving (the VIP kit will act like a crewman kit for a tank, it is a must-have to drive). If any people wish to join him, that is their choice (maybe have an engineer along to defuse mines and repair). The VIP just needs to make sure he dies within the vehicle if it happens to catch on fire and that is a rather easy to enforce and minor rule. You only need one VIP, and personally I believe it will be easy to find someone to be the VIP. I mean, if you can find someone to sit back and feed mortars ammo, drive logistics trucks/armored vehicles, or fly trans helicopters you can find someone willing to drive a badass looking SUV. I'd prefer to have it so only the BLUFOR Commander can be VIP (for pub games, making it first come first serve and giving the commander additional VOIP comms). This would mean losing your UAV capability, but thats not too big a deal.

[Rhino]

Keep in mind, this gamemode would require some basic server rules to support it. Such as requiring the VIP to remain in the VIP car

In the old VIP mode for PR we had either or a "VIP Kit" or a "VIP Car", not both. If its the kit then that needs to be picked up and taken to the end point (on Street we had a pilot pickup kit on one end of the map, and you would start at your main, cross the map to the pilot kit, pick up the pilot kit and bring the pilot back to the start to finish). With the VIP Car, ie, the SUV, it was the car you had to take across the map and the car was the only thing that counted, not anyone driving it. Really we should have added the model of a guy sitting in the back of it (who wasn't an actual player) who was the "VIP"

[=HCM= Shwedor]

My plan is a "new take" on the old VIP mode, not the same thing. This version is Escort, while the older version is more of a "rescue." The proposed version will utilize AAS-styled flags that ONLY the VIP can cap, and the rest of the team must escort him to cap each flag to stand any chance of victory. Maybe make the interim flags faster capping and the final Palace flag a SLOWWWWW cap? The SUV is there for appearances more than anything, due to a lack of a dedicated VIP skin atm it also gives the insurgents a more obvious target to engage. Note that the current plan has no new assets, skins, etc. Nothing that has to be modeled, just a few tweaks to code.

[Archerchef]

this.

[LITOralis.nMd]

Back in the America's Army 2 days, I played over 1000 hours of VIP mode on Hospital, Hospital2 and Extraction maps.

Oh gawd how I miss VIP escort maps in proper strategic TvT gameplay.

As a 16 player Alt layer or skirmish layer:
, a no vehicle, street level extraction starting in the western suburb and ending at the water level behind the hotel might be another good option. Gives the Brits an option to go north or south around the INS main. Or move the main to the oil refinery to open up that area of the map giving the Brits the North route, through the Mosque middle route, and south of the Mosque route to make it more interesting.

[=HCM= Shwedor]

America's Army 2 was the sh!t back in the day, played so many thousands of hours until the Army shut down the server providers for it. Although I was more of an Insurgent Camp fan .

There are so many ways the VIP Escort idea can be utilized, as Litoralis stated there can even be alt and skirmish layers for it. Not to mention there can be many new FOB deployed assets and other cool items to add in the future! I had a fellow clanmember propose a rather interesting one, a FOB deployed "car-wreckage" barrier to close off a route similar to barbed wire, like something off of Blackhawk Down. This game mode would open up a whole new host of possibilites for PR.

[LITOralis.nMd]

America's Army 2.5 is STILL ALIVE shwedor.
SF Extraction is still the most popular map too...

AAO25.com | Home of America's Army 2.5 Assist & the mAAp Pack Project

Servers only fill up on Thursday nights, but they built their own auth servers with the Army's permission, you can log in with your old battletracker.com account.

[waldov]

Im liking your VIP idea and I think it would be a great addition to Project Reality, I also have some more suggestions for your idea:

1. There should be slightly more flags to guide the convoy along in order to encourage the convoy to be ambushed on route to each flag instead of the convoy going all the way around the ambush zones and easily taking each flag from behind.

2. Having debris/wreckages like you mentioned before, but as a constructible emplacement for insurgents allowing the insurgents to block certain routes to the flags and maybe even for really skilled teams to "trap in" ambushed convoys.

3. If the conventional team gets any type of armour support like APCs and IFVs etc. (which they should) then the insurgents will need 1 or 2 Heavy anti tank kits (tandem RPGs) to compensate for having no bomb cars or SPGs.

4. It might be necessary to have a time limit between the flags to stop the conventional faction trying to "besiege" each flag, instead of escorting the VIP to them and blasting through any ambushes on the way which VIP mode "should" be like.

5. Possibly adding an unarmed/lightly armed recon helicopter to escort and recon ahead of the convoy in alternative mode. This will encourage insurgents to cover their tracks which is a "realistic" element they should have to take into account.

6. Maybe a few more RPGs like 8 or so, because 6 seems too little considering that there whole team can't be in one area at the same time.

7. I think the conventional force should get a single airstrike as it could "break" a deadlock and realistically a convoy could call on such a thing if engaged by an ?overwhelming? force.

8. Finally the capping time should be relatively short as its meant to be a "travelling" convoy not some sort of "take and hold" strike team or something like that. Though the last flag should take a while to cap since it should be necessary for the conventional force to ?secure? the safe zone at the end and it would add a nice twist in the game play to keep it exciting.


Well thats all I could think of sorry if all my grammar isnt too great. You dont have to take all of it aboard but I think you should seriously consider some of them. Any way great idea and look forward to any feedback.

here is some pics to give you some ideas.

[=HCM= Shwedor]

@waldov, Interesting read! The flag layout I proposed is just a suggested route, and more flags would need to be tweaked in testing. The Tandem RPG imo is a tad OP against the light vehicles that the BLUFOR Convoy would utilize, currently the proposed Basrah setup has but a single APC, everything else is lightly armored enough to die in 1-2 normal RPG shots (rovers and trucks in 1, CLV Panthers in two. The APC's can die in two shots as well). The number of RPG's I based off of insurgency, simply adding in two extra compared to what the insurgency version utilizes. Remember, if an insurgent dies and drops his kit it respawns quickly in mainbase, so really that single RPG can be multiplied if another player picks up the dead guy's kit (more than 6 RPG's possible, maybe 12 or so). Not to mention the two stationary SPG emplacements from firebases (insurgents can make fobs, but not BLUFOR). "Airstrikes" are not currently possible given the current setup in which the commander is sloted as the VIP. Also, as I previously stated, the intermediate flags should be "quick caps" (i.e. 30 seconds to 60 seconds) while the final flag should be significantly longer in comparison.

I and eskil tested the old MH-6 (unarmed Littlebird with 4 spots for infantry, one copilot, and a pilot) and it was quite effective on Basrah. Maybe if PSC faction adopts this game mode proposal (which I hope they do!) a light helicopter (I believe PSC has a Hughes MD500 series modeled?) may be added. However, to my knowledge the MH-6 is not currently in service with the British military (not that my idea is too realistic in assets).

Constructible roadblocks shouldn't be too hard to model, rather like the razor wire, but don't quote me on that as I am not a modeler/asset making badass.

[waldov]

thanks for responding and i definitely hope the PSC faction can get used for this gamemode. it would be cool if it could get a little bird or something as well and the roadblock idea is ingenious i sure hope they can add that even for the normal insurgency gamemode.

by the way have you considered any other maps for VIP i know Al Basra is the perfect choice but you'd probably want 2 or 3 maps to add some variation. Ramiel could be a cool one because its got numerous streets and alleyways as well as the seaside village and city outskirts which are choice places for convoy ambushes. you could even have Lashkar valley if you wanted to spice things up a bit the nice continuous villages and surrounding hills and river environment could be very interesting.

[risegold8929]

Some changes I would make:

a)

16. British ticket count set to 500, Insurgent ticket count set to 950

I would change this to: British Ticket Count set to 500, Insurgent ticket count set to N/A.
The Insurgents would win through the loss of all British tickets or game time out while the British would win through the cap of all the flags.
Possibly have the time limit set to 0:35 - 0:50 (maybe less, maybe more. This time limit would have to be perfected after tests as to make it fair as possible). Enough room for ambushes to happen, but also enough time for the Brits to defend against them, get out and still have the ability to win.
This would prevent the Brits from sitting in a defensive position and raping insurgents who come close to them in an attempt to get rid of the British tickets, wasting the insurgents tickets and making the gamemode boring as the British manipulate the gamemode to their advantage through superior firepower and not following the original intention.
Another option for the timer could be that the British have x amount of time to capture the first flag, then y amount of time to capture the second flag, z for the third flag, etc. With each flags timer being set to how hard the flag is expected to be to cap. The timer could either stack or be reset when a flag is captured. (E.g. 10 minutes for Flag A, 10 minutes for Flag B. Flag A capped within 8 minutes, Flag B has 12 minutes to be capped.

b) Also, as another possibility, I would add in a spawn point near the VCP until a certain number of enemies approach the spawn points or a 15-20 second timer, at this point it would disappear. This would allow the insurgents to get some default kits to the flags at the game start, allowing the insurgents to get some men at the VCP in an effort to put up a small (but dedicated) defence in the event of some British rushing to it and holding the position until the rest of the team arrive at the flag.
This would let the other insurgents with special pickup only kits to either rush to their aid, or have an even greater time period to set up a ambush point further down in the route.

[waldov]

I definitely agree withe risegolds ideas they will help balance out the gameplay for VIP mode espicially the unlimited tickets.


I also thought of a new idea for the VIP gamemode:

For starters the VIP should be a kit that spawns at the base and can be picked up by anyone, allowing the team to still have a commander and an airstrike.

once the VIP kit is picked up the VIP can enter the VIP vehicle which only he can drive. the vehicle also has room for 3 or so armed escorts.

once the convoy is ready they escort the VIP from flag to flag.only the VIPs vehicle can cap flags not the VIP himself

So if the VIPs vehicle is destroyed its not over for the VIP himself as he may have a chance to bail. if the VIP survives his vehicle being destroyed the gameplay basically switches to RESCUE as the escorting team has to now bring the VIP back to base to get him in a new VIP vehicle. if the VIP is killed then they have to wait something like 5 minutes for the kit to re spawn this will encourage them to rescue the VIP.

These new rules will give VIP mode a unique gameplay keeping it very edgy with quickly changing objectives and strategy's as well as keeping the commander intact. they will also improve the need for teamwork,communications and overall improve the realism.

[Arab]

Make the VIP have a handgun for self-protection and the unarmed kit geometries.

[Jolly]

In the old VIP mode for PR we had either or a "VIP Kit" or a "VIP Car", not both. If its the kit then that needs to be picked up and taken to the end point (on Street we had a pilot pickup kit on one end of the map, and you would start at your main, cross the map to the pilot kit, pick up the pilot kit and bring the pilot back to the start to finish). With the VIP Car, ie, the SUV, it was the car you had to take across the map and the car was the only thing that counted, not anyone driving it. Really we should have added the model of a guy sitting in the back of it (who wasn't an actual player) who was the "VIP"

Is VIP an AI or player? If he is a player, that dude would bored to death.hehe




VIP mode is good, and we may see BLACK WATER some day.lol (Watched some Discory, really awesome.)
But here is one serious matter, Are players ready for this? VIP mode might be same with CNC, which very few of servers play it...

[=HCM= Shwedor]

Make the VIP have a handgun for self-protection and the unarmed kit geometries.

We did attempt to find a decent setup for a VIP kit, here is an example. However, the frags, thermites, and the GTLD can probably be removed.

@jolly, I think this would have a better chance of success than the CnC mode which is quite really beyond the mental capacity of many PR players. And what is the worst that can happen? Going around gunning people down with an RPK is more fun than systematically hunting down caches, c4'ing caches through walls, getting raped by cave caches for hours...The only potential problem I can see is a significant increase in the size of the download for the mod . Although maybe this can replace the failed CnC. I think the game mode will be brilliant with Mumble, more so than say playing Kashan with mumble...And as Litoralis brought up, VIP escort isn't a NEW idea per-se, America's Army 2 pulled it off and really AA2 is quite similar in nature to PR infantry combat.

@risegold, I particularly like the thought of having insurgents without a ticket count, but we were not sure of how to accomplish this when making this mock VIP layer so we just set it to an absurdly high number. Maybe the DEVs can answer that question. We also added in rally spawns (5 min spawns unless knifed) in our later versions of the game mode. (Pic of where the rally bags were placed in GREEN coloring, eskil put in jets just to have some fun while testing it with 1-4 people. The red dots are potential additional flags.) We also had a 5 min delay on the spawn of the VIP SUV and a few CLV Panthers to give the insurgents time to setup, the SUV would spawn as soon as the rally bags disappeared.

[BloodyDeed]

Very good thread and suggestions guys, keep it coming.

[rodrigoma]

IMO the mp7 is too much for the vip maybe for the security escorts inside the car