Increase deployable SPG turn rate

[Mouthpiece]

Everyone loves this asset. It's dead on precise and if used correctly can wreak havoc by killing both BLUFOR inf, vehicles and landed choppers. The thing is - most of the times you can't react with it quick enough to acquire the target. The weapon turn rate is so slow, it takes almost a minute to turn it 180 degrees.

The thing I don't understand is why in SPG technicals you can manouver the gun perfectly fine (great speed), but if it's placed as a deployable - you can't. At least give the deployable SPG 50% faster turn rate. Or 50% slower than SPG techy. Anyway, make it faster. Because majority of INS SL's are not using it, and the reason is probably it's terrible turn rate (lots of people doesn't know that it can be turned with A and D buttons). Sometimes I feel like I'm the only one building it while playing INS.

Make this awesome tool more useful, please!

[Rhino]

The reason why the deployable SPG-9 has such a slow turn rate with the A and D keys, is to simulate the crew using it picking up the entire weapon assembly with tripod and turning it round by hand, which isn't a quick or simple task.

There is one thing we did think about doing and iirc, we did some testing on it initially but it didn't work out, which is to have an "accelerated turn rate", ie, your turn would start off slow, but gradually get faster as you held down the key for a longer period of time, until it reached its max turning speed. Problem with this going off memory is that you where very likely to overshoot where you wanted your turn to end up, and the acceleration didn't work in all directions but can't remember for sure if that last one was the case, was some time ago we coded it.

The SPG-9 on the technical is mounted on a pivotal point, so it swings round on that with ease just like a HMG so no need to reduce the speed of that as your not picking up a tripod and moving it round, like you are with the deployable SPG-9.

[KillJoy[Fr]]

The reason why the deployable SPG-9 has such a slow turn rate with the A and D keys, is to simulate the crew using it picking up the entire weapon assembly with tripod and turning it round by hand, which isn't a quick or simple task.
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[Rhino]

Also one thing I should possibly add to this topic is that for the Argentinians Deployable AT for PR:Falklands, which is currently the SPG-9 but that's a place holder for the Model 1968 Recoilless Gun, is that the Model 1968 Recoilless Gun is pretty much the same thing as the SPG-9, but its on wheels.



For this reason it will work pretty much the same way as the SPG-9 when its made (also note, no one is currently making it and its up for grabs if anyone is interested ), but because it has wheels, the A and D key rotation of the entire weapon will be much, much faster as a result, since the crew is swinging it around on its wheels and not picking the entire thing up

[Mouthpiece]

But for SPG-9 the "crew" (user) can rotate it because it's on a tripod of some sorts, and it also contains the pivotal point as the one on the techy, doesn't it? And if It can be rotated 360, I don't understand why it should be done so slowly?
(Edit: somehow missed the first post by Rhino, now it's clearer, but why the same system as on techies isn't used on the tripod? It would increase the efficiency)

[Rhino]

But for SPG-9 the "crew" (user) can rotate it because it's on a tripod of some sorts, and it also contains the pivotal point as the one on the techy, doesn't it? And if It can be rotated 360, I don't understand why it should be done so slowly?
(Edit: somehow missed the first post by Rhino, now it's clearer, but why the same system as on techies isn't used on the tripod? It would increase the efficiency)

The SPG-9's Tripod yes dose have a rotational pivot on it, but unlikely the TOW's tripod for example, you can't rotate the weapon 360degs on it. Your only limited to 15degs left or right from the centre. This pic shows it rotated 15degs to the right on its pivot:


We could have made this like the HMG nests where your only limited to the tripods rotation and not able to rotate the tripod itself.

If you look at the SPG-9 on the Technical, you can see that its sitting on a pivotal point that can rotate 360degs.



This isn't something we have done in PR just for the hell of it, we have done it because its a realistic design limitation of the weapon.

[Mouthpiece]

Ok, now I get it. Many thanks for the informative answers Rhino.

But, yeah, the system with the deployed SPG that you mentioned (turning gets faster in time) would be great. Or something like that.

[Stealthgato]

I don't think it would take as long as it does in game for 2 people to pick up the tube by the ends and quickly rotate, even if it's 60kg with the tripod.

[Rhino]

Hence why I talked about the "accelerated rotation" idea above, since most of the time in rotating the weapon is spent picking the weapon up and setting it back down again, rather than the rotating part.

[Mouthpiece]

Maybe if the "accelerated rotation" is really hard to implement you can at least make the SPG turn rate a bit faster than it is now. I feel that even "10% faster" would definitely help the poor situation unconventional forces are in now with their SPG's when facing fast moving IFV's/APC's . What's your opinion on this idea Rhino? Making it a tiny bit faster (the turn rate).

[Stealthgato]

Hence why I talked about the "accelerated rotation" idea above, since most of the time in rotating the weapon is spent picking the weapon up and setting it back down again, rather than the rotating part.

I was already taking the picking up and setting down into account.

[Rhino]

I was already taking the picking up and setting down into account.

Your not factoring in that most of the turning dose is actually for small amount when it needs to be moved, just a bit to the left or right, rather than a full 180deg turn, hence why an "accelerated turn" would make sense since to turn a small amount, would take only a little less time than turning quite a large amount.

[illidur]

its only 130lb and it takes a crew that long to turn it 180?
well regardless, if you made it the most realistic thing in the game would it matter if nobody used it?

[Cifyra]

Well if people use it in real combat, then people would use it if this game is realistic.

[waldov]

people do use it in game all the time one time i fired an HE_FRAG shell into a compound and killed like 5 guys.

[godfather_596]

I hate the SPG-9 I never sit on it anymore gonna always got ripped apart

[40mmrain]

I am going to agree with changing the time to swivel it. 60kg is nothing to pick up and turn.

At the moment it's really abrasive to use, questioning whether youre actually going to be able to fire on the enemy when he crests a hill or whatever. Very frustrating at times.

Further still is it's inability to aim down at all. Results in a really restrictive weapon, that is intended to be a counter but frequently fails to be effective.

[FLAP_BRBGOING2MOON]

Further still is it's inability to aim down at all. Results in a really restrictive weapon, that is intended to be a counter but frequently fails to be effective.

for real, fix this. and don't tell me that the tripod doesn't angle down like that, IRL you could put bricks or a mound of dirt on the rear feet to angle it down.

[=HCM= Shwedor]

for real, fix this. and don't tell me that the tripod doesn't angle down like that, IRL you could put bricks or a mound of dirt on the rear feet to angle it down.

Yea, put it on any surface which is even slightly elevated and it becomes useless which really restricts the usage of this AT weapon...

[KiloJules]

Have to agree on the "angle down" problem.

The turn rate is also a problem as you just can't cover more than maybe 45-90 degrees with that thing effectively. Try to only cover a smaller angle but that more effectively instead by placing the SPG covered well from the other directions and maybe even slightly obscured by a bush or similar towards the aiming direction. This way it is indeed possible to get two AP rounds on an APC for instance...provided they don't move out right away oc.

SPG challenge: Kill Abrams Tank on Karbala 10 minutes into the game with the deployed SPG - Takes only 3 rounds and a v-e-r-y slow tanker