Played for a bit tonight; First impressions and suggestions

[BlakeJr]

Please take a page from the BF2: Experience mod and change the classes. I say mkae the classes EXACTLY how they were in BF:E if Frosty is ok with that (seeing as he's part of your team now, heh). I honestly think BF:E had the classes spot on.

As a dev has already stated; What about the other sides? What do the Chinese call their classes? Same goes for MEC. I would not be surprised though if there will be some changes to the classes in later releases.

The support guns have hella recoil now--even while prone. Understandable since we can't deploy the bipod but as it stands right now we can only use 2-3 round bursts before recoil goes haywire. I'd REALLY like bipod support with the limitations implemented in other games such as DoD (i.e. limited view angle, no movement, etc). I'm torn because I dont want support to be a 100% accurate uber soldier but bipod support is sorely needed. Still seems like rifles have an advanatge over support guns at medium to far distance.

Right now it's difficult, might even be impossible, to have different recoil based on stance. You have to ask a coder why this is but it's my understanding that right now it's, a "challenge"....
Viewangle and movement: While being able to freely rotate 360 degrees when prone might not be realistic, neither is blocking movements by making it impossible to move or look beyond normal ranges. Like limiting the FOV to 45 degrees forcing the soldier to get up to look around. I'm not sure I read you right here, Are you talking about a supportsoldier who's prone and in aim mode or just prone? My comments are for just prone and NOT aimed.
If you mean that view and movements should be limited while in aim mode then yes, movement should be restricted. Perhaps one of our military advisors can explain how far a, say, SAW gunner can move while aiming and prone?

About the tanks, I'm not really a fan of the tanks in any of the BFseries games. If it were at all possible I'd like to have the tanks like in OFP. That would be great.

Firemode indicator, I believe those might come in later updates. (don't quote me on that though... )

[Super6]

this minimod is great but felt sort of like an alpha version but in any case it was fun even though my ping topped out at 887ms. I think ammo counter for veicles should be put back in with the reload time because if you are reloading you would know how much time is left and you could see the ammo left and they also whould add the over heat bar back but only when it is overheated so you know because yo uknow when a gun overheats and when it is cool. I think a health meter is necesary for infantry even if it is vague and not dead-on accurate because I think you can feel the difference between getting shot with different guns and how much 'damage' you took. I think that the armor need a vague healthbar that dosn't show excatly how damaged it is because you would know if smoke were coming out of the tnak and about how damaged it is. You need this because not all of use have 7.1 surround sound so we dont where we are being hit from so we dont know the damage it inflicted.

[Wolfmaster]

yes, some kind of way of knowing how damaged you are is good. but and ammo counter is not necessary imo.

[Tonedef]

yes, some kind of way of knowing how damaged you are is good. but and ammo counter is not necessary imo.

When you are smoking and beeping, you are to damaged...get out and run!!!

[TaZ]

In real life, do they have damage indicators?
My indicator is once the vehicle starts to smoke, you know your almost dead.

I do agree on the ammo counts, i'm suuure that real life vehicles, at least planes and helo's have such objects.

[TerribleOne]

Ammo counts in vehicles only that have superioir systems that do show the amount of ammo left should have a counter implemented on screen.
When a soldier there should be no ammo counter visable (soldiers only go by either guessing or counting rounds or look at there clip if its a see through one.)
There Should be A health indicator for soldiers but not vehciles since you know when your hurt in reality and a viewable bar ingame is the only thing that can show if your hurt or not.
Helicopters are way too responsive, they are simply too sharp in the air which is unrealistic.
Support weapons recoil is too high IMO.
Obviously in the final release ironsights will be built in to rifle grenade launchers, and hopfully any and ALL support weapons mounted on vehicles, this includes buggys, apc's blackhawks etc etc. NO gun is built without a basic aiming reticle.
Rifle grenades are too weak.
Another big issue for me is Sniping. If you are assigned to a sniper/scout squad and you carry a large calibre weapon for the job you must realise that they do not guess the drop distance - they adjust there scope to fit the target. Weapon drop is fine in all weapons BUT Snipers. I understand to implement a basic, look at target with binos to get range then entter range in sniper system is a bit too complicated for this release but i think it is needed for the real PR mod (wind and air density is mabe too much oer the top). If you enter the info you are provided with then you have a sniper accurate to that range and if you dont then well its guesswork again but for long ranges the arch of a bullet can be past 54feet (which is info i got from google that a britsh solider scored a kill in iraq with a projectile travel arch of 54feet at 900 metres.) That would mean aiming like 7 inches above the players head... so it would be too hard to get a hit without adjusting your scope.
Also 'projectile penetration' (bullets going through fences etc) needs to be done up good for PR. Id like all weapons to have unique values for different materials and thickness etc etc.

Just a few things to point out but like ive said in loads of other threads. This release is allready 20x better then BF2!! good work so far.

[OverwatchX]

Mobile AA, while greatly improved, still seems to be a little weak. Still takes a large amount of ammo to bring down a chopper and planes are to damn fast to waste cannon ammo on. Please look into making the cannons a little stronger. The mobile AA in DCR had really strong cannons but they overheated very quickly. That may be something you guys would like to consider in order to "balance" things out.

I dont want any balancing. I want pure realism. Dont increase one thing while unrealistically changing another. This goes against what this mod purports to accomplish. Make the AA rounds deadlier? Yes! Add heatup? No. Lessen it or make it spot on authentic to the real McCoy.

[BlakeJr]

Mobile AA, while greatly improved, still seems to be a little weak. Still takes a large amount of ammo to bring down a chopper and planes are to damn fast to waste cannon ammo on. Please look into making the cannons a little stronger. The mobile AA in DCR had really strong cannons but they overheated very quickly. That may be something you guys would like to consider in order to "balance" things out.

I dont want any balancing. I want pure realism. Dont increase one thing while unrealistically changing another. This goes against what this mod purports to accomplish. Make the AA rounds deadlier? Yes! Add heatup? No. Lessen it or make it spot on authentic to the real McCoy.

One life per round?

[ArchEnemy]

Currently though my biggest issue is with the lack of an ammo counter for vehciles. AFAIK all modern vehciles have some form of ammo counter and I can't understand why you guys removed it. I can live with the loss of the "health meter" for vehicles and infantry. But the ammo counter has to come back for vehicles. This is especially useful for jets, choppers, and mobile AA who have limited cannon/rocket/missle ammo as is.

I really know what you mean, all the devs agree with you. But we just didnt had enough time to implent it. It will be the first thing i'll work on for the next version.

[FBX]

I've found the AA vehicles to be simply devastating against aircraft (much more than in real life), mainly because in real life its difficult to aim those things well but in this game it isn't at all. So its real easy to shoot down aircraft in a second with mobile AA, but for some reason helictopers just absorb the damage fairly well. I'm thinking they changed the damage percent done to both of these.

However, online where your bullets count less often, the AA vehicles might just be fine. I did my testing against bots.

[Tactical Advantage]

Okay, after having mulitple people make suggestions during a game, here are some that I remember...

1. Mini-Guns need traccer's, im sure we have all seen video of many mini-guns firing, and some have traccers, this would add a cool effect in PR.

2. Mounted MG need traccers so you can tell where your hitting.

3. Less recoil on LMG and MP5(Personally I think the MP5 is fine, but oh well)

4. Faster turning turrents on Tanks.

5. More fire time on vehicle weapons, they overheat to quickly.

6. And for me, when driving FAV's, DPV's, etc. I feel like im on a massive slip & slide, possible add more traction to vehicles.

7. Almost forgot, shoot!!! I forgot

By the way, good playing with u all today...

[Medicoris]

I agree with most of what everyone had to say. However, JohnDoe is right. Project Reality has always been about realism over just about anything else (with some minor problems including the one life per round deal, which isn't really possible with the BF2 style game). That's how just about all matters should be handled as far as most balancing goes. Just remember that the more experienced, teamwork oriented side will win in the end. So even if the Americans had a more powerful tank, the MEC team might have a more experienced tank crew.

Anyways, I think there should be better material penetration on things like cockpit glass, and such. Fishw0rk and I were doing some testing with the Heli's last night. The 25mm cannon on either helicopter could kill the pilot inside the other helicopter. The .50 on a DPV couldn't pierce and the machine gun on FAV couldn't either. Not sure if you can fix this, but it would be nice if you could.

[TerribleOne]

Tracers are actually in BF2 and PR they appear as the odd 'yellow' line that youl notice.
If youve seen the cool black hawk minigun video with the fancy tracers im sure you know thats for show only. Tracers are used but only every 14th round with that gun when used not a constant stream, Tracers are not allways in ammo full stop. This means them crazy vids you see your only seeing evry 14th round the rest are pretty much invisable.

As for vehicle support weapons im assuming PR will be adding iron sight options to these to make it realistic because no body blind shoots in reality unles there not in danger and or are giving out covering fire.

I think the slower turning turrets was an improvement since in BF2 you can spin them round 720 deg with a whip of the mouse.

I do agree that most the weapons recoil is too much (including the MP5, mabe when you shot it you were younger and not as strong as the average soldier. Remember recoil varies when in the hands of different shooters depending how well they can brace the weapon.)

Another note also is its cool that weapon flash was taken of allot of weapons as it should have been however the mini gun/support weapons that are in BF2 would all have substantial weapon flash. The larger the area that hold the gunpowder, the more flash your going to get. For a quick example a .45DE produces hardly any flash at all wheras a 50AE produces a large visable flash which is not due to just the 50 head but the punch behind it is far greater. Anyway i know you all understand this so i wont go on.

I also think the mobile AA has way too much power against tanks. Also we need standard issued C4 packs not huge ones in BF2 and PRMM, the green bags would contain like 4 packs of standard issue C4 chunks.

All the rest can only be done via total change which the PR mod wil deliver so il keep quiet.

This is the vid that shows some clips of the fancy tracers (the bright red ones) which is NOT normal:
http://www.spikedhumor.com/Article.aspx?id=328

[FBX]

I thought the mobile AA was too powerful against tanks, until I realized a tank takes it out pretty quick, can then take cover, reload, then pop out and finish off the AA vehilce if it hasn't died already.

[Figisaacnewton]

I agree with pretty much everything already stated. Give us back a health bar for infantry, and at least ammo for vehicles.

and i swear changin the recoil for diff stances is possible, i think cerro thinks my idea will work:

You can control how much weapon sway there is per stance, right?
and you also have an excited sway and a calmed sway fore each stance i beleive...

make it so right after you fire, there is a very stong sway, but it only lasts for a fraction of a second.. like .2 or .15 seconds or someting. this way the sway only has enough time to pull the gun up really quickly, simulating recoil. you just have to make it last short enough so that the sway restarts between every shot ( the sway has to last less time than the rof per minute)

so, this way, you can have adjustable recoil per stance.


but the other thing you could do for the mini mod and bipods is this: fire modes. Fire mode default = no bipod, normal recoil etc.
Fire mode alternate = still full auto, bidpod out (you could even have an animation for it, and for putting it away), less recoil while prone, but weapons sway pretty bad whle standing and crouched.