CrossHairs or not

[SKyWolf]

hi i have played Opertian flashpoint for about 4 years now and that game has a Option for no CrossHairs and no 3rd person you can swith them on and off my sugestion is this will you make that option Avalabul to server admns who want to run the mod.

now i think you guys at project reality see it this way no cross hairs = relistic but may i point out this that if you pick up a gun and hold it you know whare you are Pointing the barrel the angel from youre body. you might say haveing no cross hair is relistic but i think with all games thay are simulators and becuse you play on a screen and dont have a Field of view like youre Acual eay's youre mouse is not as heavy as a gun. im not saying i cant shoot anyone with youre mod. i can i get top score playing vs elite bots but i think the that most of the people who have Downloaded youre mod dont like it becuse thare is no Cross Hair. like i said i have played ofp for 4 years and the debate between 1st and 3rd person and cross hairs and no cross hairs is thare more people play with them. just asking you yo put the option in thanks.

Relistic Suggestions

1. AT have no reload in real life becuse you can onley carry one on youre back in the field. so maby change AT rockets to LAW and RPG-7 give 3 rpgs/laws. it takes about 3 rpgs or laws to take out a m1a1 or t-80

a law can take out a TRUCK hummve or buggy in one hit

and have the Abbility to onley fire them while Croching or prone make a damage area behind the law/rpg for a feedback affect.
and you cant run while Carrying laws/ats you know how heavy thay are

also i know you cant change this or maby you can. but you cant drive and frigging gun a tank in RL. anywayz lol how about make a gunner seat and driver seat? and why the fook cant you zoom in and out with the Turret the heat rounds Raddias is realy small and shood be about 6-14 range

also on choopers with the IR heat Signature
while in a tank gunning on the top of the turret the tank shows up on IR why if the tank is not evan on? fix maby


body area Damage types change?

i shoot a guy in the foot with youre mod and he died wtf?
any ways to tweek the damage you take for sertin body parts?
maby make a option if you are hit and bleeding you can not run or if you are shoot in the leg you have to Crawl.

Medics maby make reserect player take longer them 1 sec maby 25sec or something. and why dot Combat medics have arrmor.

[Artnez]

Note that I'm not a dev, but I'll just respond with my opinions.

hi i have played Opertian flashpoint for about 4 years now and that game has a Option for no CrossHairs and no 3rd person you can swith them on and off my sugestion is this will you make that option Avalabul to server admns who want to run the mod.

I fully agree.

I am 150% for removing the crosshairs. I think no crosshairs make the game much more realistic in that you have to actually aim your shots if you want to get a hit. It also slows down the gameplay, which is good.

The only problem is that PR could possibly be used for competitive play (I think a version of PR is already used in 21CW) and people have been known to use tape to signify a crosshair on their screen. This is something that can't be detected obviously, so you never know who could be doing it.

It would be nice to somehow add a serverside option to bring back the crosshairs ... or (if its easy to do) give instructions on how to change it back for competetive games.

now i think you guys at project reality see it this way no cross hairs = relistic but may i point out this that if you pick up a gun and hold it you know whare you are Pointing the barrel the angel from youre body. you might say haveing no cross hair is relistic but i think with all games thay are simulators and becuse you play on a screen and dont have a Field of view like youre Acual eay's youre mouse is not as heavy as a gun.

Have you ever fired a rifle? Much less in a combat situation?

I haven't fired while in combat, but I have fired an M16 at semi auto, numerous pistols and a few older rifles (such as a mauser from 1919, i own that one).

All that I can say is that PR gives me a much more realistic feel (aside from the dolphin diving, but I'm sure that will change). You have to stop (or dolphin dive, lol) aim your firearm and shoot. You can't run around with a gun at your waste popping heads at a distance. If it's not at a distance, switch on full auto and aim in the general direction, such is close quarters.

AT have no reload in real life becuse you can onley carry one on youre back in the field.

Seems logical.

a law can take out a TRUCK hummve or buggy in one hit

Also seems logical. Immobilizing them atleast.

how about make a gunner seat and driver seat?

I've caught wind that this is already in the works... might be wrong though.


Im too tired to respond to anything else. Reading your sentences is kind of hard :-/

[BrokenArrow]

i believe firing an AT rocket from the prone position is very dangerous to the operator isnt it? i remember reading in BHD that many somalis seriously injured themselves, sometimes even so bad as to break their backs, and this was just from standing/crouching and firing upwards. i imagine laying down wouldnt be great.

[Artnez]

The only times I've seen those things fired from a prone position is when the soldiers were laying on an embankment of some sort... or a crator type ledge type thing. Basically they weren't laying down, but laying upwards.

[Raaschou]

[LEFT][CENTER]and you cant run while Carrying laws/ats you know how heavy thay are

Yeah, and I still run with 2 AT4's (sometimes, but mostly 1)...

Maybe you cannot run as far and as fast, but you can still run!

[{GD}Snake13]

not all AT rockets are single-use, the one currently in BF2 is not, and neither is the RPG-7

[Eddie Baker]

1. AT have no reload in real life becuse you can onley carry one on youre back in the field. so maby change AT rockets to LAW and RPG-7 give 3 rpgs/laws. it takes about 3 rpgs or laws to take out a m1a1 or t-80

It is true that there are some one-time use disposable weapons, like the 66mm M72 LAW (no longer in US service, but some are finding their way back into it), 84mm M136/AT-4 (replaced the LAW) and also the Predator SRAW (will replace the AT-4 in the future). However, the weapon for a dedicated anti-tank assaultman/anti-armor specialist is a reusable ATGM launcher, rocket launcher or recoilless rifle. The gunner usually carries the launcher and a round or two while the assistant gunner carries a rifle and additional ammunition.

We eventually plan to replace the US anti-tank weapon with reusable weapons (like the Javelin, Mk-153 SMAW and M3 RAAWS), which is why we left the Predator SRAW with additional reloads in the minimod. The M136/AT-4 (and other single-use disposable launchers for other forces) may be an option in the rifleman kit. We do plan to include the RPG-7 in the game.

and have the Abbility to onley fire them while Croching or prone make a damage area behind the law/rpg for a feedback affect.

According to the manuals (I have no personal experience), prone is the last position from which you want to fire a rocket launcher or recoilless rifle; it is dangerous because of the backblast. The safest way to fire from prone, according to the manual, when not on an incline/embankment, is to lie with your body perpendicular to the weapon. Doesn't look very comfortable and it must be really hard, if not impossible, to track a moving target.

Backblast for anti-armor weapons is something we plan to include, if we can.

and you cant run while Carrying laws/ats you know how heavy thay are

Actually, LAWs (the L in there stands for "light") you most definitely should be able to run with, as they only weigh about 8-15 lbs. Even RPG-7s are at the light end of the scale. The 30-50 lb anti-tank launchers fully-assembled will probably slow your *** down, though.

also i know you cant change this or maby you can. but you cant drive and frigging gun a tank in RL. anywayz lol how about make a gunner seat and driver seat?

We are working on implementing that.

and why the fook cant you zoom in and out with the Turret

It wasn't designed that way for the base game, but we are working on that.

also on choopers with the IR heat Signature
while in a tank gunning on the top of the turret the tank shows up on IR why if the tank is not evan on? fix maby

If a tank's engine has been on recently (and in a combat situation, it probably has been if it isn't idling, ready to go) there is still some residual heat that can be detected by thermal imaging equipment.

[Varangian]

How about a red dot a la M68?

[Artnez]

How about a red dot a la M68?

I dunno about that...

I don't think (correct me if im wrong) that it's used as commonly as you see in the movies. All it does is give away your position.

[Eddie Baker]

How about a red dot a la M68?

Some weapons will have the M68 in the game and will have that aimpoint when they go into the "down the sights" viewing mode.

I dunno about that...

I don't think (correct me if im wrong) that it's used as commonly as you see in the movies. All it does is give away your position.

You're thinking of a visible laser aimpoint projector. An M68 Close Combat Optic does not project any type of aimpoint onto the target, the "red dot" is an aimpoint inside the scope that is zeroed to the weapon. This type of sight is sometimes called a "reflex sight." The M68 is the optic you see attached to the M4A1 in Battlefield 2.

Laser aiming modules are not really favored in the US military because they tend to become a substitute for proper marksmanship fundamentals, and those skills start to perish.

[Enforcer1975]

This game is good enough, of course we don't have a real field of view but we must make a compromise for some things. Drinving and gunning a tank isnt possible, but the game is programmed this way and i dont think the Dev Team can make a change. They had to reprogram the whole game to be able to add an additional seat for a driver/gunner.
And as an OFP player i must say you cannot compare 2 different types of games even if they almost look alike. Sure you can do almost the same things like in OFP, but it is a complete different type of game: OFP = "Warsim" vs. BF2="Action shooter" with the main focus to "Action".

Damage zones in OFP are as bad as in BF2, i shoot a guy in the leg in BF and he dies. I shoot a guy in the leg in OFP and he drops to the ground and has to crawl until bandaged, i shoot him in the same leg 2 or more times again, he dies.

When AT soldiers in RPPM would only have 1 shot, the damage caused by it should destroy a tank ( like i think it is in real life ). But i don't think ppl would play the AT anymore, except RPPM would give them an M4 as backup ( somebody here mentioned they too used rifles ), and of course, with a 1 shot=kill rocket the tanks would be unnecassary . If you put RPGs or LAWs ingame you dont have a chance against a MBT ( no light anti-tank weapon can penetrate a modern tanks armor, not even the weakest spot ) Of course you can destroy a LAV or BTR and everything that has thinner armor. Even OFP isn't 100% realistic. Never heard of LAWs or RPGs completely destroying a M1, even in masses.

In case somebody still has OFP, try the WarGames Mod. It's almost realistic compared to the original OFP. You even bleed to death when you dont get first aid.

[Varangian]

If you put RPGs or LAWs ingame you dont have a chance against a MBT ( no light anti-tank weapon can penetrate a modern tanks armor, not even the weakest spot )

No, but you can take a track and then the tank's not going anywhere. It just became an exposed, stationary gun platform.

[Enforcer1975]

No, but you can take a track and then the tank's not going anywhere. It just became an exposed, stationary gun platform.

If it works...
And how do you intend to get the guys out? With a can opener?

[Artnez]

If it works...
And how do you intend to get the guys out? With a can opener?

LOL, hahaha, i needed that laugh today thanks..

[DAWG]

If it works...
And how do you intend to get the guys out? With a can opener?

You don't need to get them out, you want to stay in the tank after it's imobilised, I gaurantee you are dead inside 30 seconds. In real life an imobilised tank is nothing but a metal coffin with a gun. Air support now has a static target, or how about an artillery strike, hell plant enough C4 ( believe me enough high explosives placed correctly will take out a tank, even in real life ),or rig an AT mine and you are gone. Even if you decide not to attack the tank directly, it's going nowhere and the 2 guys inside are now less than useless to their team mates, they can't move remeber - that means they can only engage targets which enter their field of fire and guess what, no-one will enter the field of fire, your team are now 1 MBT and 2 infantry men down; Still want to sit in your wrecked tank?

now i think you guys at project reality see it this way no cross hairs = relistic but may i point out this that if you pick up a gun and hold it you know whare you are Pointing the barrel the angel from youre body.

Suggestion if I may. This is an old trick I learned some time ago, it was originaly used to give snipers a chance in a stand up fight. Zoom your weapon, then take a marker pen or other device and make a mark where the sights are pointing and zoom out, you now have a home made cross hair, it's not 100% accurate but then hip firing never is, it will however give a reasonable idea of where the gun is pointing and increase your chances of hitting something without needing to enter zoom mode.

In real life, firing without at least entering the presented stance means that the only thing you will hit with that bucking bronco is air. The man you are firing at however, stays cool enters firing stance, aims and your toast. It's not the man who fires first that wins in reality, it is rather the man who keeps his cool, remembers his training and uses the equipment provided as it should be used.

When AT soldiers in RPPM would only have 1 shot, the damage caused by it should destroy a tank ( like i think it is in real life ). But i don't think ppl would play the AT anymore, except RPPM would give them an M4 as backup ( somebody here mentioned they too used rifles ), and of course, with a 1 shot=kill rocket the tanks would be unnecassary .

The tank will never be useless, unless it is being piloted by an arse, who decided to go flag hopping without infantry support, just like it would in real life. The other alternative is to move your tanks as a unit, sure the AT guy may get 1 tank, but him and his buddies just got the shit kicked out of them by the other armor supporting or the infantry, which is now closing on the AT position. Besides that if you engage that tank head on you may damage the tank, possibly even badly damage it, but the modern composite armors used on tanks, especially on the front facing will more than likely save the men inside even if the tank is immobilised. AT weapons, at least in game are best used as defensive weapons, soldiers carrying AT weapons shouldn't be charging around the map engaing tanks at will, in reality a combined arms assault will be more succesful, which I believe is the point of PR, looks like people will have to learn to work together or fail miserably every time.

[BrokenArrow]

all good points, as far as the home made crosshair goes is there anyway to counter that? making the weapon sway more when not looking down the sights maybe?

[Varangian]

You don't need to get them out, you want to stay in the tank after it's imobilised, I gaurantee you are dead inside 30 seconds. In real life an imobilised tank is nothing but a metal coffin with a gun. Air support now has a static target, or how about an artillery strike, hell plant enough C4 ( believe me enough high explosives placed correctly will take out a tank, even in real life ),or rig an AT mine and you are gone. Even if you decide not to attack the tank directly, it's going nowhere and the 2 guys inside are now less than useless to their team mates, they can't move remeber - that means they can only engage targets which enter their field of fire and guess what, no-one will enter the field of fire, your team are now 1 MBT and 2 infantry men down; Still want to sit in your wrecked tank?

Exactly.

[Eddie Baker]

No, but you can take a track and then the tank's not going anywhere. It just became an exposed, stationary gun platform.

Not yet sure if a "mobility kill" can be implemented.

When AT soldiers in RPPM would only have 1 shot, the damage caused by it should destroy a tank ( like i think it is in real life ). But i don't think ppl would play the AT anymore, except RPPM would give them an M4 as backup ( somebody here mentioned they too used rifles ), and of course, with a 1 shot=kill rocket the tanks would be unnecassary.

Whether or not an anti-armor specialist/anti-tank assaultman carries a rifle usually depends on the unit's table of organization and equipment. Marine Corps TO&E states that the gunner of a SMAW or Javelin team only carries the launcher and a sidearm, with the assistant gunner carrying the rifle and additional rounds. I have seen few photos of SMAW/RAAWS or Javelin gunners carrying rifles in combat or training, and when they are, the rocket launcher or recoilless is disassembled/slung and the Javelin CLU is in its carrying bag.

Even the most modern, man-portable / shoulder-fired ATGMs would have difficulty taking out a fully equipped and properly maintained modern MBT in a single hit. Because they are designed to be man portable, they are subject to weight limitations, (which includes the weight of the explosive charge in the warhead). Heavier ATGMs, like the TOW II and its foreign counterparts have a much better chance of a one-shot kill. When mounted on scout vehicles, IFVs or dedicated ATGM carriers that can fire from covered or concealed positions at standoff ranges from the main gun, they are something that tanks should fear.

If you put RPGs or LAWs ingame you dont have a chance against a MBT ( no light anti-tank weapon can penetrate a modern tanks armor, not even the weakest spot ) Of course you can destroy a LAV or BTR and everything that has thinner armor.

LAWs, no, but the larger, improved HEAT rounds now available for the RPG-7 are very effective and do have a chance against MBTs in the right spots.

The tank will never be useless, unless it is being piloted by an arse, who decided to go flag hopping without infantry support, just like it would in real life. The other alternative is to move your tanks as a unit, sure the AT guy may get 1 tank, but him and his buddies just got the shit kicked out of them by the other armor supporting or the infantry, which is now closing on the AT position. Besides that if you engage that tank head on you may damage the tank, possibly even badly damage it, but the modern composite armors used on tanks, especially on the front facing will more than likely save the men inside even if the tank is immobilised. AT weapons, at least in game are best used as defensive weapons, soldiers carrying AT weapons shouldn't be charging around the map engaing tanks at will, in reality a combined arms assault will be more succesful, which I believe is the point of PR, looks like people will have to learn to work together or fail miserably every time.

That's exactly what we're aiming for.

[Enforcer1975]

Good comments, but can you realize it in a mod? Thats the 2nd thing. In almost every game where a tank is used, the crew almost never bails out until the tank is destroyed with them. Can you make a turret f.e. jam if the tank gets hit badly? That would be a great innovation in gameplay. Then, ppl would work together to bring down a tank and the other team would do the opposite thing: Protect their armor If its only: hit, hit, hit, kill. Like it's only a matter of hit points and not hitting the weak spots of a tank.

Back to the crosshairs. Of course in real life you know where the barrel points at a certain amount, but you never hit distant targets that way - that's all "hollywood style" - and i thing using a "dot" on the screen or in game like in OFP is not good. All the guys wont use the crosshairs. One thing you could do: put a bigger circle without the middle cross like that one used by the shotgun. The user knows where he is pointing his stick, but he cannot really use it to aim at a target. Even the US soldiers in Iraq never shoot without aiming or fullauto. You can always differ the sides: fullauto fire=middle east personnel, semi=western troops. And by the killratio of western troops you might recognize which one is more effective. AIming single shots or hip shooting full auto.

[Mad Max]

If you could model in a similar system as Operation Flashpoint for the tanks that would be great. Those things can become disabled. The number of times I've been hit several times on one side and then lost steering because my left tracks were screwed up, and had to either limp back to base or bail... there's too many to count.

In OFP tanks are something you truely fear on the battlfield, and you hope to god that you don't miss with your RPG or AT-4 or whatever. At least in most circumstances you'll disoreientate them enough to escape, or damage their turret so they can't aim at you. Even in reality a single TOW or AT-5 (Russian counterpart) will have problems taking out a modern MBT with one shot. Believe it or not Russian tanks are better protected against kinetic rounds than most Western tanks, as they stick literally tons worth of ERA blocks on their tanks.

Actually that's an idea... could you maybe code in shrapnel if a T-90 or something with ERA is hit with a rocket or something? So the surrounding infantry get injured. It'll make people think more about how they support the different armour effectively in the game.

Oh and the crosshair thing. I can live without it, but it can become annoying, as someone else said in reality you have a pretty good idea where you're aiming. The shotgun like crosshair sounds the best option, with just a circle. I wonder if you can make it pulse like other games when you shoot to show the recoil?