Guiding guided missiles

[Outlawz7]

Suggestion Disclaimer
Hmm, this may be:
1) Hardcoded
2) Not a priority
3) Hopefully not suggested before
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1. TV missile camera - can it become moveable like the gun and have a zoom?

2. Could we control the missile's path by Arrow keys, WASD or moving the actuall mouse instead of LMB clicking like nuts to guide it past the corner and into the window?

3. When the two seater bomber jets are going to be re-added, can we replace the guided missile with TV missile phisics? -
More accurately, instead of aiming at a vehicle and firing, when the missile gets a lock, we could click on a target on the ground, then when the missile gets fired, the gunner would have to click and hold at that certain spot, so the missile would hit it. Hopefully, the whole process can be fast enough, before the jet flies over the target.

[ZanderArch]

For the most part, your TV suggestions sound hard coded... But, it would probably be easy to replace the Click Targeting with a Laser Guidance system that would work out to be exactly what you'd want for the Two Seat Bombers' Laser Guided. Just remove the lock on and it works.

Also, for the two seat bombers, the LGB, if fired without a lock on target, will follow the cross hairs, if you'd like to test it your self, fire up vBF2, start a Local Server with a 64 map like Kurba(sp?) Dam, hop in a bomber, Fly up, hit the afterburners, then switch seats and fire a few. Just be sure to switch back before you start to nose down further than 10 degrees or so.

But, I honestly think the Attack Helicopters should have the TV guided Missiles replaced with Hellfires and their non-American equivalents. I have never once in my life heard of a TV-Guided weapon outside a video game, and even then it's only two things: The EA controlled Battlefield series and The Metal Gear (Solid) series.
So, to my knowledge they are unrealistic. Please, correct me if I am wrong.

[El_Vikingo]

I have never once in my life heard of a TV-Guided weapon outside a video game

o_0

[ZanderArch]

A quick search and I have concluded that I was right. I have never heard of a TV Guided weapon until now.
But they are rare in service and not mounted on Helicopters for use as Anti-Tank weapons. The missiles on the Cobra are modeled to look exactly like Hellfire missiles, and they are not TV-Guided munitions, they are Semi-Active Laser Homing Missiles, or in the case of the Apache Longbow, millimeter wave radar seeking.

[Longbow*]

Please leave the missiles as they are now ( maybe change lock on to tgm on the bomber co-pilot position , that sounds interesting + more skill )
They changed missile guiding sistem in vBF2142 , I had brilliant BF2 guiding skills and it took me ages to figure out how to hit targets in bf2142 . Missile is guided just with mouse moves , and it is fucking too sensible ...

[Spaz]

The only think I would like to see is that the camera stay, its not followin the missile but you see the missle flying away.

[Outlawz7]

The only think I would like to see is that the camera stay, its not followin the missile but you see the missle flying away.

Well,the laser guided missiles are followed by a rocket cam IRL, so you can see, where its heading...Gulf War 1991 and Serbia 1999, anyone?

[Outlawz7]

Also, for the two seat bombers, the LGB, if fired without a lock on target, will follow the cross hairs, if you'd like to test it your self, fire up vBF2, start a Local Server with a 64 map like Kurba(sp?) Dam, hop in a bomber, Fly up, hit the afterburners, then switch seats and fire a few. Just be sure to switch back before you start to nose down further than 10 degrees or so.

No, no, I'd like the rocket to perform as the TV missile on the helicopters. You can hit something blindly on the jets second seat, but its not accurate...and the name of the vBF2 map is Kubra Dam...







(P.S. "Kurba" means "whore" here :/ )

[daranz]

Well,the laser guided missiles are followed by a rocket cam IRL, so you can see, where its heading...Gulf War 1991 and Serbia 1999, anyone?

Hellfires do not send picture back to the launch platform...

Remotely piloted missiles aren't used too often these days, since with modern technology, guided missiles are capable of guiding themselves. Mavericks, for example, are capable of keeping track of a target the pilot designates. So, while the missile is still on the rail, the pilot/wizzo points the missiles camera on the target, and locks on. The missile then recognizes the target, and tracks it using its onboard computer. When the missile goes off the rail, the image from the missile is lost - the onboard guidance system in the missile is on its own, and guides the missile to the target designated by the launch platform. I don't remember how the two-seater bombers in BF2 worked, so I can't tell if this is what you don't want.

[Outlawz7]

vBF2 jet laser missiles worked by simply looking at something and launching the missile. Locked onto every single thing, tank, boat, jeeps, you could even shoot it blindly at the ground...

Hold on, got a video...

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=e0f_1172596695

[daranz]

vBF2 jet laser missiles worked by simply looking at something and launching the missile. Locked onto every single thing, tank, boat, jeeps, you could even shoot it blindly at the ground...

Hold on, got a video...

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=e0f_1172596695

The majority of that video was FLIR footage from aircraft performing precision strikes with laser-guided bombs. What happens is basically the pilot ground-stabilizes the FLIR camera, and selects a target. The FLIR camera then keeps pointing where the pilot pointed it as he flies over the target, still enabling the pilot to make corrections. A laser that is slaved to the FLIR illuminates the spot in the middle of the crosshair. This is used to guide laser guided bombs, and is basically a modern optical targeting system for that purpose.

That one all-the-way-to-the-target video was probably from a GBU-15 or an AGM-130, which were used in Kosovo... The GBU-15 is an unpowered bomb that indeed can be remotely controlled, but also has an internal guidance system. Control of the bomb can be released at any time after you pick out a target, and it will automatically guide itself all the way down. The AGM-130 is essentially the same thing, but with its own motor, making it a longer-range standoff precision strike weapon. The thing is, AFAIK, these are used for precision strikes, similar to what LGBs are used for... There isn't really much room for that in PR, where most bombing is done as part of CAS. Yeah, there are some bridges to take out, and you could bomb the hell out of destructible buildings with one of those babies, but the majority of what you do as bomber aircraft right now is attacking enemy armor, vehicles and infantry.

Jeez, I really get into these things, don't I?

[CAS_117]

A quick search and I have concluded that I was right. I have never heard of a TV Guided weapon until now.
But they are rare in service and not mounted on Helicopters for use as Anti-Tank weapons. The missiles on the Cobra are modeled to look exactly like Hellfire missiles, and they are not TV-Guided munitions, they are Semi-Active Laser Homing Missiles, or in the case of the Apache Longbow, millimeter wave radar seeking.

TV guided missiles were pretty sparse as far as actual combat use goes, I mean just the low-key, unreported conflicts like um...

1974 Yom Kippur war
Falklands
Operation Desert Storm, Fox, Hound, Shield and Sundae...
Vetinam War (you may have heard of this one, but I can't be sure...)
Israeli Lebbanon Conflict (80's).

[ZanderArch]

TV guided missiles were pretty sparse as far as actual combat use goes

Exactly as I said, they are rarely used in service and definitely do not have a place on the stub wings of an Attack Chopper.

Of course, if these were to be redone to act more like their real life counter parts, being "Lock on, Fire, Forgedda 'bout it" they might become too easy to use, but the current TV and Click-Click-Click system just doesn't work for me. I think they should work like the Laser Guided bombs from Vanilla, only without the Lock On mode. Still requires the Gunner to guide it in, but isn't something as unrealistic as TV guided weapons, still unrealistic, but balanced.
This would also free up their range since now they aren't constricted to the small view you have that is controlled by the pilot, maybe not as large of a view as the Bombers, but at least 30 Degrees left and right and 40 or so up and down. This way, they still require some coordination between Pilot and Gunner, but not require you two to be thinking with the same mind.

[CAS_117]

Exactly as I said, they are rarely used in service and definitely do not have a place on the stub wings of an Attack Chopper.

Of course, if these were to be redone to act more like their real life counter parts, being "Lock on, Fire, Forgedda 'bout it" they might become too easy to use, but the current TV and Click-Click-Click system just doesn't work for me. I think they should work like the Laser Guided bombs from Vanilla, only without the Lock On mode. Still requires the Gunner to guide it in, but isn't something as unrealistic as TV guided weapons, still unrealistic, but balanced.
This would also free up their range since now they aren't constricted to the small view you have that is controlled by the pilot, maybe not as large of a view as the Bombers, but at least 30 Degrees left and right and 40 or so up and down. This way, they still require some coordination between Pilot and Gunner, but not require you two to be thinking with the same mind.

Dude TV Guided Missiles are, have been, and WILL BE in use for as long as people are interested in killing each other! The cobra carries TOW missiles, not hellfires. The model doesn't matter.

[Outlawz7]

The majority of that video was FLIR footage from aircraft performing precision strikes with laser-guided bombs. What happens is basically the pilot ground-stabilizes the FLIR camera, and selects a target. The FLIR camera then keeps pointing where the pilot pointed it as he flies over the target, still enabling the pilot to make corrections. A laser that is slaved to the FLIR illuminates the spot in the middle of the crosshair. This is used to guide laser guided bombs, and is basically a modern optical targeting system for that purpose.

You have guessed correctly.

Altough I still like the fact, that you can see where the missile is going...we should just add an empty greyish screen (like when your TV brakes down and no channels to watch ), once missile hits target...

Then again, reality before fun.

[eggman]

I think the system used for the wire guided TOW missiles is a more realistic representation of how helicopter missiles are targeted (aside from the fire and forget apache missiles).

We ran into some problems when trying to make that work and haven't yet got around to revisiting it.

There's lots of little annoying things piling up in PR that we need to take a look at. We're kinda winding down on major changes to the fundamentals of the BF2 systems we inherited and generally the team is looking at v0.7 as a release to focus primarily on polish as it will probably be the last release before we call it 1.0. So hopefully we'll have better luck with this when we revisit it.