Something Auspicious

Piratn · Post by **Piratn** » 2008-04-11 01:30

Respectful greetings to everyone!

I am fully aware that this is in fact, my first post (on this particular forum), and I need no reminders whatsoever concerning that. Thank You.

Ill go right away to the point of this post (which is, yes, my first), which is: Isnt it auspiciously conspicious that so much software is being released seemingly without a traceable history of testing?

To Clarify myself:

1. Issue discovered.
2. Hotfix created.
3. ?
4. Profit. (As in: Releasing that hotfix worldwide and happily discovering that a large part of the playing community is, in fact no more playing and thus concluding that that hotfix really "busted" those "punks". Problem solved.)

Anyone noticing something weird? Ah, yes, step "3" is cleary missing some good 'ol "testing". In a recent and wellknown issue regarding some "punks" messing with some "shadows" and thus gaining unfair advantages, no testing whatsoever took place regarding the hotfix, or so it seems.

The side effects of the hotfix was that a large portion of the gaming community no longer could start their beloved mod anymore, and that it took two weeks before a Czech guy whacked together a bunch of scripts in a shed outside Prague and enabled us to play again.

I mean, had just one person tried a couple of different setups on his computer (bf2 retail/downloaded etc.) he would have no doubt stumbled upon this problem himself, and if a as huge amount of people as 10 did it, it would be just slightly less inevitable than that bills will arrive every months to discover that the hotfix caused massive-un-playability-thingies.

This is not flaming, if I didnt care about this mod, I would not have bothered 10 minutes writing this, but too many things like this (as in: locking out half the gaming community and forcing them to rely on some, albeit wonderfully ingenious, but nevertheless a non-developer-from-a-shed-outside-Prague-guy) might really kill a mod off.

Yours sincerly/
Piratn

Post by **LeadMagnet** » 2008-04-11 01:37

Unfortunately we are currently in the midst of retaining a new batch of testers to begin work on .8. As soon as I get the go ahead I will be posting a sign-up for testers on this forum.

In regards to the hotfix being released I imagine it was a case of a lesser of two evils. Those who were bypassing the shaders were doing more harm to the game than the hotfix could.

MadTommy · Post by **MadTommy** » 2008-04-11 06:58

You seem to be exaggerating the problem massively.

Yes it has been reported that some honest people are having trouble due to the MD5 checks in place. It would appear to me that the vast majority have no such problems.

I mean, had just one person tried a couple of different setups on his computer (bf2 retail/downloaded etc.) he would have no doubt stumbled upon this problem himself

You make testing punkbuster check kicks sound very easy, i'm not sure what kind of different setups you are referring to? Clearly the DEVs did not have kick problems or they would not of released it, and i'm not aware of anyone in the T&T community with these kicks either.

You have to remember anyone with a problem shouts load on the forums... 99% of the happy users never say a word. So a problem always sounds worse on these forums. Is the problem really as bad as you make it out to be?

Post by **Masaq** » 2008-04-11 07:16

Piratn wrote:This is not flaming, if I didnt care about this mod, I would not have bothered 10 minutes writing this, but too many things like this (as in: locking out half the gaming community and forcing them to rely on some, albeit wonderfully ingenious, but nevertheless a non-developer-from-a-shed-outside-Prague-guy) might really kill a mod off.

Yours sincerly/
Piratn

Why is being in a shed in the Czech Republic any less good than being in a shed in the UK? Does it particularly matter who comes up with the lines of code that help with bug fixes, or matter more that somebody does?

As for testing on different hardware setups, I assume you're implying that between one and ten members of the PR team (whether they be the nominated testers or the mod's developers) should go out there, purchase all the different copies of the game, and then install them in various means and methods, in as many variations as possible?

BF2 stand-alone from disc
BF2 stand-alone from disc with SF, EF and AF via EA downloader.
BF2 disc with SF on it
BF2 disc with SF and EF on it
BF2 disc with SF, EF and AF on it
BF2 stand-alone via EA downloader
...

Now I'm sorry but that's just unrealistic. The team make this game in their spare time, and for no monetary recompense. It's asking a bit much for testers to buy three or four different copies of the game each just so that each new version of the mod (or as in this case, each new hotfix) can be tested on a different software installation method.

In addition, the time lost to testing each new release on each version by each Dev/Tester would pretty much take up most of the time spent testing each new release and leave rather less time to find problems and fixes for them in the first place.

So while I agree that yes, it's a bugger that some people have found they're getting kicked - my brief reply is "If they come to these forums and ask, they'll find a ton of people telling them how to fix the problem".

If they can't be bothered to make use of a resource like this community... *shrug*.

Post by **bosco_** » 2008-04-11 07:44

The problems with the md5 checks are, for the most part, fixable by the player.
Some people apparentely don't want to, though.

kilroy0097 · Post by **kilroy0097** » 2008-04-11 08:32

*raises hand and points to thread here*

I've done everything suggested to me to try. I have done more than most in problem solving. I still have an issue with MD5 kicks and have not found a resolution. What other recourse do I have? Am I part of the percentage of fans that is, to put it bluntly, screwed?

Post by **Deadfast** » 2008-04-11 12:35

[R-MOD]Masaq wrote: Why is being in a shed in the Czech Republic any less good than being in a shed in the UK?

Because my shed is more east-looking than yours!

'[R-MOD wrote:Masaq;650854']...I assume you're implying that between one and ten members of the PR team (whether they be the nominated testers or the mod's developers) should go out there, purchase all the different copies of the game...

I don't think he's suggesting that each tester should have all the version.

I think he meant that there should be testers with various versions of the game.

Post by **Masaq** » 2008-04-11 13:31

Well in that case; I don't think anyone outside of the DEV, CON and testing teams can possibly know what systems the 0.75 testers were each running their systems on lol

Yes there's problems with shaders at present, yes the team are working on it. End of story?

MrD · Post by **MrD** » 2008-04-11 13:47

At least we admit to the community that in the path to creating a fully comprehensive version of the mod we acknowledge that with each build there are experimental, tweaked and sometimes bugged parts of the game.

All software contains bugs really. Software is huge compared to the 50k games we saw with old 8 bit home computers. Internet gaming adds another element to it. Then the fact that pc's are not fixed hardware/software games consoles has an effect.

If the biggest software companies cannot get it right 100% of the time, how can a community creating a mod take software with existing bugs, add elements to it, fix all the existing problems and new problems and give the player a 100% working game?

It's more a philosophical question you ask. Requiring unlimited resources, manpower and time.