Insurgents don't suck, you do!!

Scot
Posts: 9270
Joined: 2008-01-20 19:45

Insurgents don't suck, you do!!

Post by Scot »

Well as per request of Masaq(oh mighty one to some) I have been asked to make this thread. So here goes:

Insurgents are not a conventional force. Play them like a conventional force, you will die and die and die. The simple fact is their equipment sucks. Compared with the M4s of Korengal and Ramiel, and the L85s of Basrah, the equipment is inaccurate, and bigger recoil than the NATO forces. However you can win as insurgents because you have one thing you don't have in AAS mode. You have the element of surprise. They don't know where you are, what you are attacking, how many there are of you. So use it effectively.

How many are you leads me nicely onto my next point. Just because you don't have rallys, in no ways means you don't use Voip and work as a squad. Working as a squad is even more important than ever when playing as insurgent because again, you put an M4 against an AK47 or SKS, I would say 8/10 times the M4 wins. However you put 3AKs and 3SKSs against 6 M4s along with the element of surpirse, you have yourself a damn good opportunity. So ALWAYS work as a squad, and ALWAYS listen to your SL.

So insurgents can't be used as a convenitonal force, we have gathered that, so what can you use them for?

Well lets go through the main one:
Ambushing:
There are IEDs on the insurgent side. These are bloody useful, they are a big explosion in a small package. Now lets see how to strategiaclly place IEDs.
FIELDS and use of deep foliage:
Fields are an insurgents dream spot for IEDs. The IED is so small that if NATO forces move through there, 9/10 they won't see it. Now NATO forces like areas like this as they offer huge protection, but with huge protection comes great loss of vision and awareness. What I like to do is bait them in.
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Blue Dots - Insurgents
Purple dots - US/UK Forces
Red dots - IEDs

Now here we have 2 insurgents, I prefer them with Aks who see the US/UK and fire and bait them towards the field. I can guarantee that 9/10 the US will follow. The diverters make sure that they go to the field and not either side. Obviously you can kill them beforehand, but they do get through sometimes. The important thing here is to have your IED holders be either completely hidden or not to shoot. This relys on good comms from the other 4 to know when to blow them. So you either kill them, or drag them in the field and blow the living hell out of them.

That's just a pretty simple idea there on ambushing, obiously there is road ambushing but that is pretty damn easy to be honest so I won't explain that here.

Now another huge thing about insurgents is to use your head. There is nothing more fun than sitting back as US/UK forces with an ACOG/Susat and picking off stupid insurgents who try and snipe with the SKS or AK. So don't do it. Use Vietnam tactics and get up close the enemy, don't shoot until you are certain of the kill. Also a tactic I like using a lot, is take out the back man, and then open up on them from behind(no sexual pun intended) and you will get yourself at least 3 kills.

Continuing with using your head, when you die and then spawn and die, a clever thing to do is either all spawn together as 6 people(took out 2 full squads with this method), or spawn somewhere different, again with all your squad and take out those soldiers.

Finally on using your head, a lot of the time, being insurgent involves waiting for some poor guy/s to walk along into your sights, and then you kill him, by all means hunt the US, but hunt them around the cache, so you always have defence, as insurgents can win a hell of a lot if they wait for the US to come to them as if you are an AK lieing down waiting for some poor sod to run towards you, you will kill him, but wait for him to get close then shoot, don't try and long range shoot, as you will most likely lose ;)

These are just a few of my methods as a insurgent, I don't claim to be a hugely awesome insurgent player, but don't moan about how they suck as they can easily win every time, they have the advantage in that they have surprise, they have the possibilities of ambushing, if used right they can take on any squad that gets in their way, so lets just summarise my points:
1. Insurgents aren't a conventional army, don't play like on. Ever.
2. Squad play is, in my humble opinion, the most important part for insurgents, play like a squad. Always.
3. Ambush your enemy, bait them, then kill them.
4. Don't try and be an AK sniper. You will fail. Hard.
5. Wait for the enemy and you will kill them.
6. Use your head.

Feel free to post anything you want to add, but don't spam my thread, or you can be sure you will have an IED up yer arse :mrgreen:
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Gaven
Posts: 349
Joined: 2008-08-31 14:31

Re: Insurgents don't suck, you do!!

Post by Gaven »

Great post, and it's true, too often people play them in head to head battles and get their asses handed to them.
Cyrax-Sektor
Posts: 1030
Joined: 2007-10-15 21:12

Re: Insurgents don't suck, you do!!

Post by Cyrax-Sektor »

Insurgency fan tip: Smoke.

The US/UK will sometimes pop smoke to retreat. While their backs are turned, use their own smoke screen to your advantage.

At CQC, that AK can tear the enemy to shreds and IEDs, Molotovs, RKGs can be thrown safely in the cloak.
ReadMenace
Posts: 2567
Joined: 2007-01-16 20:05

Re: Insurgents don't suck, you do!!

Post by ReadMenace »

OH GREAT MASAQ!

*WARNING: I HAVE NOT PLAYED 0.8*

As I see it, the only reason the Insurgents are 'target practice' is because the way the individual players choose to play. People need to recognize that the Insurgent's lack of personal armor and scoped weapons make them ill-equipped to go toe-to-toe with the Brits, USMC, or US Army. Even liberal use of rocket propelled grenades does not make up for this imbalance.

What it comes down to is specific tactics that the Insurgents *should* use to engage their enemies. Some of these can be gleaned from reading about or viewing real accounts of the insurgencies in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Some effective tactics include engaging helicopters over dense urban environments, first with harassing small arms, distracting it from the primary threat of a MANPAD or RPG.
Use collaborators to your advantage! Nobody wants to accrue 5 minutes of time-out for killing civilians. Not just the old 'bait & switch' of a civilian luring conventional forces into an ambush, but also using them as human shields.

DO NOT allow the enemy to begin a firefight, if you aren't firing the first shot, retreat and try again; Always fire from concealment, never attempt a stand-up fight; you will lose sooner, or later.
Your weapons are not scoped (SVD/Enfield aside); negate their range advantage by never engaging them from a distance, allow them to come into your ambush before engaging!

Marksmen/Snipers: You are supporting the ambush, not THE ambush. You should not be in the main ambush party, instead you should engage from a medium range, and perpendicular to the main ambush party. While your teammates should too focus on precision shots (not the spray & pray we usually see by insurgent forces), you will be putting nails in your adversaries' coffins.

I hope this helps new players, and old alike. Please critique if you'd like.

-REad
Spinkyone
Posts: 200
Joined: 2008-07-02 22:40

Re: Insurgents don't suck, you do!!

Post by Spinkyone »

<.D.F.E.>
Last edited by Spinkyone on 2009-12-05 20:47, edited 1 time in total.
daranz
Posts: 1622
Joined: 2007-04-16 10:53

Re: Insurgents don't suck, you do!!

Post by daranz »

I find that with the new ticket system, simple harassment is a valid tactic. Since insurgents don't really get penalized for dying, they can afford to engage enemy forces even when they don't expect to win outright.

On the other hand, the NATO forces will go for the largest concentration of insurgents, rather than try to find the weapon caches. So, defending directly FROM the cache might not be as effective as defending from a position overlooking the cache. The enemy is more likely to try to take your defensive position rather than to continue their search for the cache while taking fire (even if it's sporadic and inaccurate).

This ties in with baiting the enemy: making them believe that you are sitting on their mission objective is often the most effective way of getting them to advance in your direction.
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Salah ad Din
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Re: Insurgents don't suck, you do!!

Post by Salah ad Din »

Insurgents do get penalized for dying and currently they can only build two shelters (but this is a bug, I hope and will be repaired soon).
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daranz
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Re: Insurgents don't suck, you do!!

Post by daranz »

Salah ad Din wrote:Insurgents do get penalized for dying and currently they can only build two shelters (but this is a bug, I hope and will be repaired soon).
What I meant is, ticketwise, they don't.
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Hfett
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Joined: 2006-06-10 20:50

Re: Insurgents don't suck, you do!!

Post by Hfett »

Insurgents can kick every army *** with an infinite suply of GL and RPG's.
www.joinsquadbrasil.com.br
Zeppelin35
Posts: 191
Joined: 2008-01-13 02:55

Re: Insurgents don't suck, you do!!

Post by Zeppelin35 »

One thing I noticed is that no one chooses the Cell Leader kit. With the new grenade launcher sight that kit is deadly. Yesterday my squad attacked a US squad dug into a building and I rained death upon the enemy with the grenade launcher. Screw mortors strikes, I am a freaking mortor with that thing.
Hfett
Posts: 1672
Joined: 2006-06-10 20:50

Re: Insurgents don't suck, you do!!

Post by Hfett »

Best way to defend a cache:
Ins Cell Leader hides himself on the top of one building or at the top of a montain(depends on the map). Deploy a hideoud near the cache and keep GL's from the top of the building
1 dude with RPG near the cache to keep RPGING enemy infantary or whatever trys to get near the cache
1 dude with graplin hook on city maps. Stay with the SL to make sure he can get on top of buildings and get back to the cache to reload.
3 dudes with sabouter kit, place ied's on all the possible entrances to the cache, dont be afraid to explode everything that comes near the caches even if you have to explode youserself. And use your nades, you can always reload at the cache or respawn at the hideout, so dont be afraid to do jihad rushs =P

Dont stay on the open ground, place the Ied's and hide yourself at the houses, alwats trow the nade before rushing against conventional army and try to avoid long range combat, the enemy needs to be at close range to be killed, at long ranges, use the Cell leader GL and RPG's
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gazzthompson
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Joined: 2007-01-12 19:05

Re: Insurgents don't suck, you do!!

Post by gazzthompson »

with only 1 cache location, set all hideouts near it,(suppose to be 4, but bugged right?) then new cache location demo order and set new one. make sure hideout isnt near mosque or mapper placed spawn
The_Blitzcraig
Posts: 86
Joined: 2007-03-17 23:41

Re: Insurgents don't suck, you do!!

Post by The_Blitzcraig »

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A tactic that I use is having around 4 insurgents fire from inside a building at an enemy squad to get their attention, then once the enemy begins to fire back and advance on the building have the insurgents run out the backdoor while 2 ambushers quietly watch from a distance with IEDs placed in or around the building the insurgents fired from.

Usually the enemy squad will pursue the gunmen and search the building, this is when the ambushers detonate the IEDs killing some if not all of the squad.
badmojo420
Posts: 2849
Joined: 2008-08-23 00:12

Re: Insurgents don't suck, you do!!

Post by badmojo420 »

Since insurgents don't really get penalized for dying, they can afford to engage enemy forces even when they don't expect to win outright.
I agree with this, but a lot of people say this to justify running towards the enemy time after time. The penalty is intelligence points. The only reason insurgents have tickets is to let you know how many caches the enemy needs to destroy.

Last night somebody even said that since we had 3 caches revealed it didn't matter how many times we died. It's annoying to defend a cache from the start of the round, that never gets destroyed, and still lose the round.

I always hate it when people say 'insurgents suck' because i always want to answer with, 'no you do!' but most of the time they dont really suck, they just don't know how to play as insurgents.
PFunk
Posts: 1072
Joined: 2008-03-31 00:09

Re: Insurgents don't suck, you do!!

Post by PFunk »

Well if we're to look at my experience on Fool's Road last night we should also say that British Infantry suck too. I mean really. We so lost that round cause the tanks owned us. Infantry are no good at all.

Oh wait thats right, 4 full squads and a Scimitar squad all acting like morons. Defending village by sitting inside it and letting the tanks pound them til they're all dead. Nobody in the hills, everyone just standing at main poking their stupid little heads over the hill to get shot at while they try and... I don't know really, snipe the tanks?

I had a HAT but I couldn't get a good shot cause nobody wanted to go with me into the hills so that I could hit the tanks from an oblique angle and the hills were now swarming with militia.

I don't think Insurgents suck, or are even boring. Whats boring is losing a round BADLY because people don't have the conceptual intelligence to not stand in a valley or right next to a mainroad when tanks are all over the place. My bloody squad leader didn't tell us to run into the hills near us, no when the tanks were audible he decided to have us run across the intersection where half the squad got stranded in the open.

I hate playing insurgents because I can't ever find a squad or team of them that aren't idiots. Non-conventional warfare isn't even that hard. But I get so frustrated with these people!
[PR]NATO|P*Funk
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-=TB=-Tobakfromcuba
Posts: 526
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Re: Insurgents don't suck, you do!!

Post by -=TB=-Tobakfromcuba »

The_Blitzcraig wrote:Image

A tactic that I use is having around 4 insurgents fire from inside a building at an enemy squad to get their attention, then once the enemy begins to fire back and advance on the building have the insurgents run out the backdoor while 2 ambushers quietly watch from a distance with IEDs placed in or around the building the insurgents fired from.

Usually the enemy squad will pursue the gunmen and search the building, this is when the ambushers detonate the IEDs killing some if not all of the squad.
i see youve placed 4 ieds with 2 ambushers.
may i remind you 1 ambusher can place 8 ieds or maybe you just wanted only 4 ieds in the scenario for purpose.
Solid Knight
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Joined: 2008-09-04 00:46

Re: Insurgents don't suck, you do!!

Post by Solid Knight »

Pro tip: Point muzzle at enemy.
[ECGN]Spitfire
Posts: 31
Joined: 2007-01-30 23:48

Re: Insurgents don't suck, you do!!

Post by [ECGN]Spitfire »

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What happens if the US/UK come from the North, West, or East?

If you have enough time to detect the enemy and predict their avenue of approach(by luck) then you should be good. If not. Youll have 1 cache destroyed with 6 dead insurgents.
Solid Knight
Posts: 2257
Joined: 2008-09-04 00:46

Re: Insurgents don't suck, you do!!

Post by Solid Knight »

It really depends on how the US team is playing. I mean, I've gone on suicide runs to destroy the cache which as worked. You just need to get a grenade on one which isn't too hard. I've also blown right by insurgents just to get it. When I'm coalition forces I'm about killing caches first and insurgents second. Baiting doesn't work because if they run off then I don't give a ****. I'm not going to give up a go at the cache to kill some random insurgent or walk into a trap.
Sadist_Cain
Posts: 1208
Joined: 2007-08-22 14:47

Re: Insurgents don't suck, you do!!

Post by Sadist_Cain »

pretty piccis, better to just remember the basics of Baiting, Ambushing and guerilla fighting.

I see too many insurgent squads working tight together and trying to go head to head against a coalition squad = FAIL

spread the squad wide, find the enemy, surround them and unleash all hell you can, the moment they organise themselves and start hitting you back RUN! get more ammo, medic up and just wait for them to become vulnerable again, they're weaker now.

never expect to wipe out whole squads at a time (thought it can happen) expect to have to hit them 2 or 3 times to sort them out

lastly always try and bring the fight onto your turf that you have control over. just had a round with no end of fun as an ambusher. We'd lure squads into our midst by firing potshots and then backing awy, once they advanced BOOM!
Best moment, WMIK chasing after a technical on Al Bas, twisting and turning through the streets I get the technical to drive past me, where I promptly lay an IED, Tech drives past with WMIK in pursuit and badda boom boom :P
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