Hide the next flag until the first one is capped

[hotfranc]

Hey guys,

We just lose a game in about 20 mins because the enemy rushed our first flag on iron ridge. I just had an idea. Why not hide the other flags until the first flag is cap. So each team see his first flag. then, when they capped it, they see the next flag and this again and again. This is gonna be harder with Kashan and some other maps but it will avoid the usual first enemy flag rushing.

Thanks a lot

[Imchicken1]

Well, each army is going to move into an area knowing the order they're planning on securing each area. So of course all the soldiers of each army are going to know where they're going to need to go.

It's a good idea, as it IS Gameplay>realism, but im not sure if it's possible in the BF2 engine

[Arnoldio]

Well, each army is going to move into an area knowing the order they're planning on securing each area. So of course all the soldiers of each army are going to know where they're going to need to go.

It's a good idea, as it IS Gameplay>realism, but im not sure if it's possible in the BF2 engine

Why would then 2 armies know eachothers vital points... the sistem is weird by default.

so...

THIS IS THE BEST OF THE SIMPLEST IDEAS EVER TOLD ON THE PR FORUMS!

I dont know why i didnt come up with it (probably because i didnt come up with anything really good anyway...).

It is possible to delete the flags on the map itself (deleting the picture or somethin...) and just letting the attack/defend marker stay there. Wich would work.


This solves many issues with the game.

Rushing, hey its still possible to do it so dont whine, you just need to know where the enemies are, wich leads to...

Recon, in order to know their other flags snipers and SF guys and others come into the play.

Centralizing the fight, it would "force" people to attack the active flags but still let them flank and do summersaults and whatnot...

Usage of the UAV and seeing more COs (hopefully)

Also it would improve as gameplay as the realism.

Only thing bad that comes to my mind is the new line of squads "Flag Hunters", wich would go out and seek for enemy flags. But that is what snipers and recon and other guys like that should do...

Ofcourse you would still see the capping time and everything when you are in the radius as it is now, but no enemy/uncapped flags on the map.

I never really asked devs to put something in the game, but i would want have this in the game rather than the dynamic sky, backup ironsights and csb bridges together. (but i know you will get them ingame anyway... )

[TheOldBreed]

so basically, it's turning AAS into insurgency style gameplay. i don't think this is good at all. 'rushing' flags? there is a distinct style of warfare displayed by the Germans in the first two years of the second world war, by the Israelis in 1956 and by the coalition in 2003 that would constitute to flag rushing.

i think that was an exceptional tactic on the part of your adversary.

[Arnoldio]

so basically, it's turning AAS into insurgency style gameplay.

You are partially right.

But then you're completely wrong.

You would play AAS as normal, cap flags in order. After each flag you cap, the next one pops up at the exact center of the cap radius. Same for the enemy team. Eventually the teams should meet between 2 flags as they do now.

So you see its not about that, the core gameplay wouldnt change.

[goguapsy]

I like that! Would encourage team-sized work and real recon squads that need to find where is the enemy stronghold! Just like ChizNizzle said. +1 for this incredible idea.


EDIT: It must be random AAS BTW...

[A_Mosquito]

I agree with ChizNizzle, great idea. and it WOULD give snipers and recon more usefulness. Howevr, places like Kashan would make little difference since there's only a few flag locations (unless the devs start putting them out in the open desert, which would be an interesting challenge to defend). If the hiding of flags can be worked into gameplay, it should only be added to AAS random maps like Iron Ridge, Lankshar Valley, or Op. Barracudda IMO. maps like Kashan, Ochamchira, or even Jabal al Burj just don't have enough areas of suficient cover to put flags. Overall, it's a great idea though, and can hopefully be implemented.

[Rissien]

Would only work on random flag maps, Kashan is easy its always the same order, even Silent Eagle is fairly easy because only two of the flags are random.

[Spec]

Still, I'd add it on all maps with any random element. You could still "rush" ahead, but you'd not know where EXACTLY you need to be. Which means a squad might be deployed behind the actual front line while the others are still capturing a flag, but this squad would have to stay hidden until they are informed about their next objective. Maybe that'll lead to more interesting tactics.

[TheOldBreed]

i'm still not a fan of this idea. in the field, commanders and such would not be like "sick, we got this point locked down...oh shit the next point top capture is behind us, that was a complete surprise, better get to it", running around the battlefield to random points.

a well laid plan is the best medicine, that's what the count down timer before a round is for. you can see all the points/objectives for capture, thus make a credible strategy i.e. gun it down to the enemy's first point of capture and stall their reinforcements.

i agree with the whole revamped recon element this would give, but recon is also extremely effective (it is when i'm runnin a recon squad haha) when you know the points of enemy concentration e.g. a captured point, because you know the approximate channels the enemy will come from.

[Bringerof_D]

the main advantages i see is that it takes away enemy first flag rushing. using squads as shock troops to slow down the enemy would then rely not on holding an enemy objective as it is now but actually seeking out the enemy and disrupting their transportation to their objective.

so all in all this is actually a + both for realism and game play

a better version of the UAV to use in scouting will very much enhance this feature

[Rissien]

An attacking force would already know where they wre stiking anyways, not very smart to attack with no intell on where and what.

[Arnoldio]

Even on preset maps like Kashan and such it would help as you wouldnt know if they capped and what they capped. (Until the flags meet) If the global text "USMC capped Sough Village" messages would be disabled.

The ideal way would be if you can see your own captured points even when you moved your attack forward, but that would be probably harder to achieve. (see the OP Barracuda explanation below).

i'm still not a fan of this idea. in the field, commanders and such would not be like "sick, we got this point locked down...oh shit the next point top capture is behind us, that was a complete surprise, better get to it", running around the battlefield to random points.

a well laid plan is the best medicine, that's what the count down timer before a round is for. you can see all the points/objectives for capture, thus make a credible strategy i.e. gun it down to the enemy's first point of capture and stall their reinforcements.

1. There wont be any points behind you. Is there any now? No. The random flags are grouped and almost everytime they are picked in a order wich pushes the frontline forward. Even if there are flags behind now, you still have to go there somehow.

2. Rushing like that is too easy. If you want that tactic you should risk it or prepare it well. Now it just defeats the point of the game actually. The feature would represent your team not knowing enemy locations until you "collide" with them on ther path, imagine getting "intel" to "reveal" the next flag, wich is allready there but invisible at the moment.

Another benefit i see is (on the maps that have neutral flags), that there is a lot more time avaliable for the teams to establish well guarded FOBs especially when the first flag is to be capped. (RUS on Beirut).

On OP Barracuda though, PLA would all their flags but US would only see the first one or two (depends on the group) wich would tighten defenses even more, were talking about direct head on attacks exept if the attacking team uses some clever flanking tactics). Also there is very little chance for PLA to get ambushed at the safe fallback point.

But still you have your 6 avaliable FOBs, you can still use airport, docks and beaches as your own sub-flag to fend off enemies even if those arent your main flags. Then again comes the recon part. Lets say you cannot get beaches as US, so you need somewhere else to land your choppers. Send in a recon squad to get you a safe LZ or go in all or nothing.

This opens so many aspects of the game its not even funny anymore.

[Rissien]

On OP Barracuda though, PLA would only see the first pack of flags (beaches, airport, docks...) but wouldnt see the fallback point (wich would be the next flag for US to cap.). On the contrary, US wouldnt see it eaither until PLA would, so there is very little chance for PLA to get ambushed at the safe fallback point.

Why wouldnt they know their own fallback point untill the last second? Alot easier to have it preplanned and ready to fall back to rather than some mad scramble to it.

[Arnoldio]

H[=Rissien;1370390']Why wouldnt they know their own fallback point untill the last second? Alot easier to have it preplanned and ready to fall back to rather than some mad scramble to it.

Yeah I fail lol.

Actually your own team would see all the capped flags, wich means PLA would see all the flags. US would be the one who doesnt see them in that case.

Sorry again for my fail.

[bloodthirsty_viking]

i dont like the adiea... at first i though OMG EPIC WIN IDEA!!!!...

then i thought some more, and i realised that i actually considered the flags, not actually flags but "points of possible enimy heavy resistance"

whereever you are on the map, you expect resistance, but arround the flags, you expect more. And before a battle, you would pick out those flags, and say... ok, we think that the enimes will group arround these areas.


Their are times where its compleatly wrong, aka, a fob in the middle of nowhere, and times where its right, aka, many a squads defending it...

[Serbiak]

H[=Rissien;1370256']Would only work on random flag maps, Kashan is easy its always the same order, even Silent Eagle is fairly easy because only two of the flags are random.

Maybe it could be a new gamemode only with certain maps then.

[goguapsy]

This will prevent this:

(screenie from HunterMed from [AAR] The Usual https://www.realitymod.com/forum/f112-p ... usual.html)

Please, DEVs, take a look into this. Is that doable? That would unite the team much more by making recon squads work as a team, so as the whole team work as a team since no one knows where to attack!

[Arnoldio]

whereever you are on the map, you expect resistance, but arround the flags, you expect more. And before a battle, you would pick out those flags, and say... ok, we think that the enimes will group arround these areas.

Commander can set his own flags (waypoints) wherever he predicts the so far invisible flags are so yeah, argument pretty much invalid. Why would two teams expect resistance at the same poinst? Thats unrealistic.

Maybe it could be a new gamemode only with certain maps then.

Either this or as it is. Why would we have two random AAS gamemodes. Like having insurgency as it is now and another gamemode where cache markers are coloured different. Makes no difference in gameplay.

Yesterdays Alpha Project Event Night... very original act from the IDF team ensured a great start of the round.

Yes, as soon as we landed with two choppers there was a squad or two IDFs here waiting for us and mowed us down instantly. How i enyoj PR when enemy knows exactly whare the oppsing team will land? If they wouldnt see RUS first and following flags, they could still go wait at the factory docks and west city center and see where we land.

[xI DIaboLoS Ix]

ChizNizzle, I find your suggestion very well thought out and a good idea.

But flag rushing, is well, dangerous for the team that does it. For example if a team does decide to rush a flag that is not capable and is met by a strong defence (which MOST teams should do instead of rushing) and in turn is defeated. Most of the team is now stuck with out transport and with out their beggining assets that they need to effectively meet the enemies on the battlefield. Therefore the team that didn't rush, then can advance relatively freely with little resistence. However this is all in theroy.

Remeber that in pr, every action you take has risks that can come back and bite you in the a** later on. So it's all about thinking on the spot, creating new techniques and strategies to defeat the enemies tactics. Often i find people here on the suggestion forums laying out their problems here that they couldn't find a solution to on the battlefield. Where ussualy these "problem suggestions" can ussually be resolved with new strategies.
A soldier isn't as strong as his weapon is, a weapon is as strong as the soldier holding it. That statement is true on so many levels.

Diabolos.