Sniper kit suggestion

[Qadis]

WHAT about adding this to the sniper: making any hit from the sniper rifle insta death. I'm still unsure about whether this should take away 1 or 2 tickets, I'd probably prefer 2 tickets, although I could see the instant death being a big enough punishment for an enemy squad already.

Why add this ? It would give it a distinct advantage over the marksman kit, and it would be an added benefit to the stuff you could already do with the officer kit (you wouldn't just gather intel for the team, you could actually bring the hurt to the enemy). Now, I'm not saying you aren't already hurting the enemy with the sniper kit we have today, but you aren't much of a threat, really - this is especially true against organized teams that have few to none lonewolves.

Imagine being on the receiving end. Facing a sniper would actually instill some fear into your squadmates.

Possible downsides of this:
- even more people would want to lonewolf with the sniper kit. However, I don't think much would change: most of the time both of the sniper kits are taken in games anyway, especially at the beginning, and the people that are using the kit as it should be used won't change their tendency to do so (gathering intel for the team)

- it would make the kit too powerful, especially in the right hands. I don't know about this part, it might be true, but it doesn't need to be. It would definitely force people to work together more and to become better at using cover, eliminating the sniper threat and to have better situational awareness.

A possible compromise to the 2nd downside would be to have the insta kill applied only to headshots made by the sniper. This would balance the skill requirements of the sniper and the squad he is facing a bit (if needed).

P.S.
Forgive me if this has been discussed already, I did a quick search, mainly in the Sniper Kit Removal Discussion thread, and didn't see any similar suggestions, so I decided to post this.

[Kingy]

There annoying enough already, no thanks

[goguapsy]

You are not insta-killed because getting wounded and revived represents another soldier in your squad.

I asked the same thing, "why in the World do you not get insta-killed if you get HS'ed with a .50cal"?

It's all about gameplay.

And your downsides are too right... too overpowered. Whilst I rarely see people sniping with marksman kits, it is quite often when I see a sniper in an infantry squad. With your suggestion, that number ought to increase.

[chainsaw.exe]

Yeah any improvement should be one to STOP people taking them at the start of the round and trying to get as many kills as possible instead of collecting intel.

[Boris.T.Spider]

I rarley use the sniper kit, but practaily all the people I shoot are insta-killed anyway, as they are either other snipers/spotters/lone wolves generaly people with no medics, either that or they are HVT's on AA's or TOW's. But when all is said and done, the sniper rifle is no more deadly than any other weapon designed to put holes in people, if anything, they should be less deadly as they only put one hole in someone, a G3 at close range will put 10-20 holes in someone.

[Qadis]

You are not insta-killed because getting wounded and revived represents another soldier in your squad.

Yeah, but if you added this, the only way you could get another soldier in your squad so fast would be via a rally point (assuming you're relatively far away from a fob), and this wouldn't always work due to being able to place a rally only every few minutes and when there's no enemies around.

Yeah any improvement should be one to STOP people taking them at the start of the round and trying to get as many kills as possible instead of collecting intel.

Yeah, but I don't know of any improvement to this kit that would stop people from rushing to take it and at the same time make it more useful. However, this would reduce the damage caused by people rushing to take the sniper kit by making it easier to use effectively.

But when all is said and done, the sniper rifle is no more deadly than any other weapon designed to put holes in people, if anything, they should be less deadly as they only put one hole in someone, a G3 at close range will put 10-20 holes in someone.

Well that's true, but I'm focusing on the gameplay aspect here. After all, this wouldn't make the game any less realistic than it already is.

[Dev1200]

1. Making any hit from the sniper rifle insta death.

2. It would give it a distinct advantage over the marksman kit.

3. But you aren't much of a threat

4. It would make the kit too powerful, especially in the right hands.

5. A possible compromise to the 2nd downside would be to have the insta kill applied only to headshots made by the sniper. This would balance the skill requirements of the sniper and the squad he is facing a bit (if needed).

1. Doing so will entice squads to take the kit (especially on the british team's sniper with the variable-zoom scope, and other factions with the same setup) with the sole purpose of insta-kills. Being able to circumvent revives is such a HUGE advantage over the enemy, I could easily see squads doing this.

2. The marksman kit is essentially an assault rifle which can be fired faster with less deviation, due to the bipod. For some armies, it is more powerful (m21, SVD). Also for some armies, it has the same zoom level as scoped rifleman (Namely the L86, STAR[iirc]).

People need to stop thinking the marksman is a sniper system. It doesn't work like that in PR, and should be used like a scoped rifleman.

3. Snipers are already a threat in PR. It's a one shot kill, however it's exceptionally difficult to revive after a sniper put someone down. If you smoke, they can just line up their shot, look at the scoreboard, and when that person gets back up, fire.

4. See #1

5. I can see this happening, since a headshot with .50 or 14.5 (iirc) is a instant death.



Suggestions belong in the suggestion's thread. ^_^

[KP]

That they do. And because I'm so nice, I've moved the thread instead of just closing it.

[Spec]

Bleh. With the current medic/respawn system, no.

As a squad leader, it's sucky enough to lose a squad member and having to put down a rally point, which are now limited in many ways. I'd rather not waste my rally point because some random lone wolf decided to shoot one of my guys, forcing me to retreat to the nearest FOB when I have someone killed in the next real firefight, because I can't put a rally point again or whatever. It'd just be plain annoying.

Maybe there should be something that makes sniping squad leaders more worthwhile.

If it's only headshots - okay, I can live with that, that at least takes some skill to pull off.

Then again, the sniper kit is already good enough in the right hands.

[goguapsy]

5. I can see this happening, since a headshot with .50 or 14.5 (iirc) is a instant death.

It's not.

[Mouthpiece]

I take a glimpse in to the future and all I see is lots of people abusing the one-shot-kill advantage and people trying to take the kit as soon as possible (standing by a crate and spamming kit-pickup). With this ability in mind snipers will be more willing to use the powerful gun instead of keeping silent and gaining intel for their team. So that means less teamwork and more lonewolfs with a big-fucking-gun.

Thank you for the suggestion good Sir, but NO.

[Bringerof_D]

Bleh. With the current medic/respawn system, no.

As a squad leader, it's sucky enough to lose a squad member and having to put down a rally point, which are now limited in many ways. I'd rather not waste my rally point because some random lone wolf decided to shoot one of my guys, forcing me to retreat to the nearest FOB when I have someone killed in the next real firefight, because I can't put a rally point again or whatever. It'd just be plain annoying.

^ i think that's the point of the suggestion, right now a medic can just run in, pen him, and gtfo. a sniper needs to be more of a burden on the enemy team when engaged. I rarely ever play sniper but when i'm engaged with one i always feel it's a bit too easy to deal with them, and they dont really hinder me in any way. you should need to fall back to an FOB and you should need to waste a rally. that's the point of the suggestion.

[Silly_Savage]

It's not.

It is.

__________

On-topic: Just. Yes.

Even if it's so only headshots are considered insta-kills.

Fear the sniper.

[saXoni]

.50 headshot = dead-dead.

[HAAN4]

I still thinking about if this is reality against game play,

but in PR where there not enough men or equipment for the scale of the terrain, a wounded soldier will make the enemy lost more time that a killed soldier.

if a sniper KILL a enemy, the eatery squad will move in in order to avoid a second shoot. but if he is wounded they will try to aid he, in this case you will be able to shoot the medic, so there is 2 soldiers down,

i guess at this point they are solfted enough to pass the Intel to the team so a squad move in and kill the remaining 4 guys couting that if the support kit and the medic kit is down, i guess it will be not a problem to a regular squad suppress it, since the squad is probable in panic due to the casualties and the lack of medical carry, and have no AR kit to toe to toe



in fact making the rifle KILL the enemy will more nerfing that overpower to the sniper kict itself. the foes suppressing ability.

my opinion

[Qadis]

1. Doing so will entice squads to take the kit (especially on the british team's sniper with the variable-zoom scope, and other factions with the same setup) with the sole purpose of insta-kills. Being able to circumvent revives is such a HUGE advantage over the enemy, I could easily see squads doing this.

What's wrong with that ? It would add some more variety in building squads, and both sides are able to do it.

2. The marksman kit is essentially an assault rifle which can be fired faster with less deviation, due to the bipod. For some armies, it is more powerful (m21, SVD). Also for some armies, it has the same zoom level as scoped rifleman (Namely the L86, STAR[iirc]).

People need to stop thinking the marksman is a sniper system. It doesn't work like that in PR, and should be used like a scoped rifleman.

Yeah but in PR, you can do the same shit a sniper does by using the marksman kit instead, usually even better.

3. Snipers are already a threat in PR. It's a one shot kill, however it's exceptionally difficult to revive after a sniper put someone down. If you smoke, they can just line up their shot, look at the scoreboard, and when that person gets back up, fire.

Err, you know, when you are playing in a 32v32, the scoreboard isn't so reliable unless you memorize everyone who died (or who is alive, depending on which is easier) in the enemy team just before you snipe that dude. This is especially difficult if you're dealing with a moving target - you simply wouldn't have time to do this and manage to kill him. So it's kinda luck based if you don't memorize the scoreboard from before. Aside from that, you have to SCROLL to see all the enemy players.

Furthermore, alot of the time you're dealing with people that you don't snipe in an open space, and even then, if you want to make sure you kill that guy, you have to focus quite long on that spot in the smoke where his body is, which is way too long for tunnel vision. This is even worse in cases where that squad will not only assign squadmates to suppress you, but will also tell the rest of the team about you and make you quite vulnerable during the period where you are focusing on preventing the medic from reviving the 1 guy you sniped.

Also, I'd like to mention how this feature would also make suppression by these squad mates a bit scarier, too. At the moment, if you manage to find an obstacle in between you and the sniper, like a small wall (usually not too hard), you aren't that worried about suppressing him since you can always rely on your medic to get you up in relative safety.

[quote=""'[R-MOD"]KP;1599795']That they do. And because I'm so nice, I've moved the thread instead of just closing it.[/quote]

Thanks. It was kinda weird no one posts in this section so I avoided it... won't do it again.

[quote="Mouthpiece""]I take a glimpse in to the future and all I see is lots of people abusing the one-shot-kill advantage and people trying to take the kit as soon as possible (standing by a crate and spamming kit-pickup). With this ability in mind snipers will be more willing to use the powerful gun instead of keeping silent and gaining intel for their team. So that means less teamwork and more lonewolfs with a big-fucking-gun.

Thank you for the suggestion good Sir, but NO.[/quote]

Well, people already whore for the sniper kit as it is. More lonewolves ? Probably the same amount, since there's only 2 sniper kits and they are usually always taken. However, the point about non-experienced players being more enticed to use the sniper for kills is true. At the same time, the people that right now gather intel for the team realize it's part of their job, and I don't see them changing their behaviour because of this.

Now the question is, should we balance the game for the masses, or for the 'elite' players ? This is a quite important question, one I'm not sure about myself, but it makes balance and gameplay discussions hard because people usually take 1 side of that question without thinking about the consequences the balancing of the game for the masses will have on the gaming experience of players that want their game to require skill. This is a discussion for another thread, though.

I still thinking about if this is reality against game play,

but in PR where there not enough men or equipment for the scale of the terrain, a wounded soldier will make the enemy lost more time that a killed soldier.

if a sniper KILL a enemy, the eatery squad will move in in order to avoid a second shoot. but if he is wounded they will try to aid he, in this case you will be able to shoot the medic, so there is 2 soldiers down,

Well you won't be able to shoot 2 soldiers down if they smoke up and if they know where you are (therefore making attempts at supressing you). For further explanation of this read the 5th and 6th paragraph of this post. In the worst case scenario, their squad leader will be competent enough to decide it's not worth risking their medic (if the guy you sniped died in open space and far away from cover).

i guess at this point they are solfted enough to pass the Intel to the team so a squad move in and kill the remaining 4 guys couting that if the support kit and the medic kit is down, i guess it will be not a problem to a regular squad suppress it, since the squad is probable in panic due to the casualties and the lack of medical carry, and have no AR kit to toe to toe

Consider this: if what you are saying is true in most cases, people that have played the game for a while usually won't try to revive squadmates killed by the sniper because previous experience has shown it usually ends up pretty bad. So this change (adding instakilling for the sniper) wouldn't nerf the sniper kit, but it wouldn't make it any better either.

Just pointing out a mistake in your reasoning here, not saying that what you have described is usually true. It's not, and that's why the sniper kit should be improved.

[Spec]

^ i think that's the point of the suggestion, right now a medic can just run in, pen him, and gtfo. a sniper needs to be more of a burden on the enemy team when engaged. I rarely ever play sniper but when i'm engaged with one i always feel it's a bit too easy to deal with them, and they dont really hinder me in any way. you should need to fall back to an FOB and you should need to waste a rally. that's the point of the suggestion.

Yes, my point is that it would be frustrating for the other players. You can't really do anything against being sniped. Why should it be this punishing?

Of course, if all weapons had the means of insta-killing in some form, again, that'd be a different story. But in my opinion, there's no reason to give the most hated kit in the game another advantage at the cost of the most enjoyed kits in the game. (Buff sniper, which noone likes to fight against as it is, nerf infantry, which everyone loves to play; and you'll just have a worse game than before)

[killonsight95]

the sniper kit in PR is the DMR kit but for SL's of recon and CAS SQ's. its rifle is meant to harrass and take down SLs and medics not be a super killing gun such as the AR.
People seem to think that IRL snipers are killing machines able to take down people in one shot... well they're not! unless a sniper shot you in the head/neck (which if i'm not mistaken is alreay in-game) you wouldn't die straight away.
Snipers are already a massive pain in the arse! you get shot by a sniper the whole SQ has to stop to find it to make sure they get cover from it and they also have to heal the downed man which will allow you to tell your friendly squads that and enemy infantry SQ is comming their way and prepare for it, don't forget a sniper has the ability to call down CAS and even artillary barrages if they are a SL. That's a powerful asset.

[Wakain]

to be honest, I find snipers intimidating and lethal enough as they are right now.

[cheesus182]

I don?t know if this is hardcoded since I have never entirely tried it but assuming this comment is correct it should work.

.50 headshot = dead-dead.

How about insta-killing a soldier if he is shot in the head by a sniper but not if he is shot in the chest where he is wearing full body armor.
Surely that should protect him enough from being instantly dead rather than being crytically wounded so a medic has to rush to help.

It would give the sniper a little bit more challenge and would end up being a fair balance between being over powered and not.