Weapon aiming does not fit reality

[Darknecron]

It's a necessary evil.

Till they figure out some way of making it weapon sway <.<

[Murphy]

It would be awesome to be able to estimate where your bullets will fall (in ARMA it's almost like you can snipe while moving), but the deviation system they have now does make for nervous 2-3 second stand offs while both players wait to settle. I personally enjoy the fact that the current system rewards patient shooters with clean shots, while maintaining a sense of urgency telling you to pull the trigger.

[Qaiex]

Damn it! More grief from the MW2 keyboard warriors.

[Pronck]

Always shoot bursts of 5 bullets, because the recoil is so high then, that it will become accurate!

[a0jer]

Damn it! More grief from the MW2 keyboard warriors.

:facepalm:

never played it. and i can hit stuff in PR just fine.

however, i think deviation is an awful compromise that causes more problems than it solves

[Amir]

And the aiming sight of the M16-family is a bit too big =) ( I mean the circle where you look trough )

OT: Yeah, at some points I agree that it's practicly hard to hit with the weapons, I mean one of the most occurring things in PR is; "You walk down the street/dessert/wood, you see an enemy at a distance of 10 meters, both of you lie down and fire an entire clip in semi-automatic. The most bullets fly around in the most remarkable places your gun isn't even pointing at."

Yeah ...

[Nitneuc]

both of you lie down and fire an entire clip in semi-automatic.

That's where you do it wrong.

I don't see anything wrong with the current deviation, it's by far the best compromise we had in the mod.
0.5-0.6 lazor rifles didn't make sense at all (ever managed to dive on the floor and headshot someone 200m away in less than 1/2 second ?), 0.7 and 0.8 deviation was really excessive, I remember using the officer sidearm a lot during these.
In 0.85 things started to get better and with the few adjustments the prone stance, LMG and marksman got, 0.9+ have IMO close to perfect deviation system.

I've got the feeling that people complaining "they can't hit shit" with it may not fully understand how it works (see previous post). nedland always provides a detailed deviation explanation for each release. Maybe it should be stickied as it's a good start to learn how to use each weapon.

[Qaiex]

:facepalm:

never played it. and i can hit stuff in PR just fine.

however, i think deviation is an awful compromise that causes more problems than it solves

If you have a better solution we'd love to hear it. You know, seeing how weapon sway hardcoded.

[gazzthompson]

And the aiming sight of the M16-family is a bit too big =) ( I mean the circle where you look trough )

OT: Yeah, at some points I agree that it's practicly hard to hit with the weapons, I mean one of the most occurring things in PR is; "You walk down the street/dessert/wood, you see an enemy at a distance of 10 meters, both of you lie down and fire an entire clip in semi-automatic. The most bullets fly around in the most remarkable places your gun isn't even pointing at."

Yeah ...

You realize in the latest PR patch, going prone causes massive deviation? and its much better to just stand or crouch?

Seriously, do people still prone spam? it dose not work.

If you have a better solution we'd love to hear it. You know, seeing how weapon sway hardcoded.

i support deviation fully, understand it and love it. But i would like to see open betas of any "alternatives".

The ones off the top of my head are what they did in CA, which IIRC is:

Reduce deviation
Add ballistics
All rounds are tracers (because of tracer bug with adding ballistics)

The idea (i believe) was the addition of ballistics made it harder to fire at long range.

And current Deviation but an increase in power across the board of weapons.

[a0jer]

You realize in the latest PR patch, going prone causes massive deviation? and its much better to just stand or crouch?

Seriously, do people still prone spam? it dose not work.

they do, and sometimes it does, being a smaller target makes up for the deviation increase if both players have high deviation to begin with. (this is at ranges less than 50m)

And current Deviation but an increase in power across the board of weapons.

I almost agree, but in my mind maximum deviation (not settle time) should come down to make close quarter fights quicker and deadlier. Regardless, damage should definitely go up.

[Amir]

I'm not saying I can't shoot these, I can, but somethimes your reflex is to lie down.. so..

[Boris.T.Spider]

Going prone is now exactly what it should be, a last ditch attempt to break line of sight with your enemy which leaves you vulnerable and helpless, not a gamey exploit to give you l33t marksman abilities. In the open street scenario, even if by some freak of chance you actually manage to kill your opponent, you are out of cover and practicaly imobile, making it easy for you to be picked off by one of his squad mates before you can reposition. Even undisputed king of the prone divers, Max Payne dies most of the time lying on the ground reloading and he has zero deviation, 8 pistols and bullet time!

[Boris.T.Spider]

they do, and sometimes it does, being a smaller target makes up for the deviation increase if both players have high deviation to begin with. (this is at ranges less than 50m)

Its not always the case, if the enemy has any elevation on you, diving prone actualy increases your body profile making you a bigger target. People who develop the bad habit of prone diving often seem to forget this.

[Excavus]

post above you



I don't like deviation, but I don't hate it either

Heh, he's denying it. Nobody likes deviation.

[Nebsif]

Hate when MW2 kids who neva held and shot a rifle IRL QQ about deviation.

[a0jer]

Hate when MW2 kids who neva held and shot a rifle IRL QQ about deviation.

0/10 must troll harder

[Aaka20]

ONE SHOT! Another...Another...Another...No Kill? All Were Headshots! WTF LAMO

[Grasli]

Till they figure out some way of making it weapon sway <.<

If PR was a mod for BF2142, that would be possible. BF2142 has weapon sway and I love it. BF2142 has both weapon sway and heavy deviation when going prone. I LOVE IT! And as an extra thing, it seems like the hit detection is close to being perfect in BF2142!

I assume thats one of the big reasons why so many from BF2 didn't like BF2142, because it was hard for them to kill there. The weapons had sway and going prone gave you a lot of deviation. It wasn't/isn't like early BF2 where going prone made your weapon like a 1337 lazor.. And beside that, weapons in BF2142 are less accurate in hip-mode than in BF2 but more accurate when zooming then BF2 (vBF2 doesn't even reduce deviation much when zooming after the patches)..

Anyway, enough of BF2142 talk. If there only were a way of making weapon sway work in BF2.. I guess it isn't possible at all, otherwise I think we would have had it by now..

[placiddavid]

Well doesnt that 2-4 seconds it takes for your sights to line up increase when using a acog?

[obZen]

Sometimes I think the initial deviation is wrong though. In practicality many people will open both eyes when looking through the site just to get more vision on what's going around and to prevent tunnel vision, and when you spot something you can have the site where it needs to be in a split second, or they may not bring up the sight until they actually see something. I find it kind of funny sometimes when you run into someone say 50m away and you both crouch, then sit there for a second trying to get the deviation down...it's probably the worst thing about PR I can think of.

Perhaps the deviation time should be reduced by 50% only when you bring up your sights and haven't moved, changed stance or done something that would otherwise reset the deviation to max.


Also if you look at the HAT kit, it has 2 white brackets on the side that expand/contract based on the deviation, would it not be possible to have something like that in our weapon sights just to indicate our deviation size?