[Vehicle] Zastava 900 AK [WIP]

[Smegburt_funkledink]

[quote=""'[R-DEV"]Rhino;1406906']One thing I would suggest is to chamfer off the edges of the tires as right now they are quite blockey on the sides if that makes any sense [/quote]

[quote="altfuture""]Thanks, fixed .[/quote]

What about the tires, are they that sharp on the other PR models?
Looks really good btw

@Priby - What about reading the thread?

This looks mint mate!

[Hauteclocque]

Sorry, I forgot to answer your questions in my last post.

should interior share the same texture as exterior?

It's up to you to decide. (but don't have huge texture sheets :razz

What is the technique of making glass, do I model it with thickness? Is glass part supposed to have an alpha map included and again, does it use the same texture as the whole vehicle?

You have two solutions :
-you include your windows in your texture if you want to make dust effect, etc on it (with alphas in the diffuse or the bump map texture)
-you don't take care of this, and the exporter put the generic glass texture on your windows. (no need to put them on the UV sheets)

Lastly, is there anyone who would be willing to import this vehicle to the game if you like it?

Sure, I can do it when your model and textures are done.

[cyberzomby]

Wauw! Excellent! I can already see the insurgents and taliban cruising around in one of these

[altfuture]

Thanks guys!

It's up to you to decide. (but don't have huge texture sheets :razz

Roger, I will see about fitting it all to a single 2048^2.

You have two solutions :
-you include your windows in your texture if you want to make dust effect, etc on it (with alphas in the diffuse or the bump map texture)
-you don't take care of this, and the exporter put the generic glass texture on your windows. (no need to put them on the UV sheets)

Nice, I will definitely include my own windows texture.

Sure, I can do it when your model and textures are done.

Awesome

Here's some pics, I finished the basic interior (again, not optimized yet so no wireframe):

[Rhino]

looks good, although is all that floor detail viable once all the seats and other interior objects are in? if not you should just make what you can see

Also for the windows, you need to model them as polys and then they have an transparency layer done though the alpha channel of the colour/normal map applied to them

And ye a single 2048x2048 sheet is good, thou will most likley be downsized to 1024x1024 when it goes ingame due to performance but dont let that put you off, much larger objects ingame only use 1024x1024 textures currently like the Challenger 2

[altfuture]

looks good, although is all that floor detail viable once all the seats and other interior objects are in? if not you should just make what you can see

I'm not sure, but I think it will be visible from the fifth position. Even if it won't, it doesn't use too many triangles, and I really wanted to make this vehicle complete so that it can be easily modified for other uses too Or other games, like Arma2 R maybe.

Also for the windows, you need to model them as polys and then they have an transparency layer done though the alpha channel of the colour/normal map applied to them

Roger, will do. Does alpha map support grayscale values or only black and white?

And ye a single 2048x2048 sheet is good, thou will most likley be downsized to 1024x1024 when it goes ingame due to performance but dont let that put you off, much larger objects ingame only use 1024x1024 textures currently like the Challenger 2

No problem, I'm sure it will look good that way too

[J.F.Leusch69]

it might also be an idea to make a seperate texture for the interior only and than have the rest on another sheet, so we can have a number of different colored vehicles which all share the interior texture, that would also help performance, but would only makes sense if the interior cane be same same on the vehicles no matter of its color

[Rhino]

I'm not sure, but I think it will be visible from the fifth position. Even if it won't, it doesn't use too many triangles, and I really wanted to make this vehicle complete so that it can be easily modified for other uses too Or other games, like Arma2 R maybe.

ye rgr you can always delete/optimize unseen faces afterwards

Roger, will do. Does alpha map support grayscale values or only black and white?

Can do grayscale

it might also be an idea to make a seperate texture for the interior only and than have the rest on another sheet, so we can have a number of different colored vehicles which all share the interior texture, that would also help performance, but would only makes sense if the interior cane be same same on the vehicles no matter of its color

Ah ye forgot to mention that. Basically Altfuture in BF2 we can have separate 1st person and 3rd person models. With this its also worth having separate 1st and 3rd person textures, with 1st person textures for the interior objects and at a much higher rez.

There are two ways of going about this.

1: The first way is that you model a low poly interior and have the interior textures on the normal 3p sheet and has separate UVs from the 1p interior (note a simple way of then texturing it is to bake the interior textures off the 1p model onto the 3p model) and then the 1p interior you add a lot more detail to it and UV it onto its own sheet.

2: The other way is to just make a high poly model for both 1st and 3rd person, with all the interior UVs on there own sheet, and then when the model is all done and textured you then separate the two models into 1st and 3rd person, and optimizing the 3rd person model a lot, probably remove a lot of elements while your at it and optimizing the big ones, keeping the UVs intact and then when it comes to exporting the model you have two separate interior textures sheets, which are basically excatly the same textures other than the 1p sheet is much higher rez and the 3p sheet and you might also want to change them a little.

Option 1 is the best for performance, although there is a 3rd way:

3: The 3rd way is basiclaly combing the two methods which is to model a high poly interior, UV it all onto the 1p sheet then when you separate the two models you leave a gap on the 3p UV for the interior objects to go into, and then you can either texture them by hand or bake them off the 1p textures

Its really up to you which way you want to do it thou but it is worth having separate 1st and 3rd person models, otherwise your staring at a dash board with only a few pixels on it and a steering wheel with only 6 edges

Also you can use the 3rd person textures fine without any issues in the 1p model for the exterior items, + any interior items you want too just dont use the 1p textures on the 3p model (unless your going down the option 2 method with the same UVs but separate sheets).

[altfuture]

Took me some time to swallow what I just read, so I will summarize how I understood it to be sure if I understood it well

So, there will be two different models, seen from inside (1p) and seen from outside (3p). 1p model has a high res exterior plus high res interior, and 3p has a high res exterior but has a low res interior.

The best way for performance is to have two textures that will contain:

1p - high res interior independent from exterior
3p - high res exterior plus low res interior

+ if I make the interior also independent from external paint, we can have the van in different colors in the game with least performance hit.


If this sum up is correct, it's no problem for me to make it that way. So what the low res interior should be like, 500 tris?

[Rhino]

1p models at what you see from when your sitting inside the model yes, like the cockpit of a chopper and what not, but most of the time the exterior is excatly the same as the 3p model, with just unseen faces you can not see form the inside of the model removed and it also uses the same 3p textures for the exterior of the model (+ maybe some interior bits).
3p models are for what the vehicle looks like to anyone not sitting in the model, from walking next to it to being in anouther vehicle looking at it.

and ye, can have the van in different colours too going that way but try to not make too many colours, a lot of textures can be used up doing that


If you want later tomorrow I can give you some examples of 1p and 3p models and there differences on current vehicles so you can see more for yourself how it works but right now I can't.

[Hauteclocque]

So, there will be two different models, seen from inside (1p) and seen from outside (3p). 1p model has a high res exterior plus high res interior, and 3p has a high res exterior but has a low res interior.

Actually the 1p mesh (called geom0 in the bf2 export world) contains your high res interior + some parts of the exterior (all the parts of the exterior you can see from the driver/passenger positions)

I advise you to do two models : one high res interior model, and a high res exterior with low res interior model.
It will be up to the exporter to cut the parts from the exterior in the second model and add them to the 1p mesh, don't take care of this

Edit : damn, ninjad by Rhino

[altfuture]

Thanks for the help and your time Rhino and Hauteclocque, much appreciated! I think I fully understand what to do now, see you on the next update

[Rhino]

Right going to give you a few quick examples of 1p and 3p models made with the two main methods using the Lynx and the Chinook, then going to also give you an example of the landy 1p and 3p models as that should help you too

First of all the Lynx, which is been made in Method "1" as talked about earlier, with making a low poly interior then making the high poly interior afterwards.

3p model first, got everything there you would expect and low rez interior etc, 3p model also made out of 6,035 tris.




Now here is the 1st person model, notice looking from the outside we can see lots of missing faces but once we are sitting in the pilots seat or in the back, we can't see any of that, also notice the higher rez models and mainly textures, but still the tri count is less than the 3p model at only 3,637 tris due to the exterior faces being removed, also the rotor blades, air filters etc all all separate objects and they stay on there 3p models with just how BF2 works, although you need the main rotor anyways since you can see that from inside it hehe:





Now here is the Lynx's 3p textures and if you look hard enough you can see some low rez elements of the interior textures:


And here is the 1p textures, notice how none of the 3p textures are on them:


Although the Lynx actually uses very little of the 3p mesh in its 1p mesh, there are still tiny bits that do use the 3p mesh/textures in it like the things just before the pilot:





Now onto the Chinook since I think we have covered the Lynx now, remember the Chinook was made in method "2" where you make a high poly interior to start off with and then for the 3p model you cut down on your tris, although still keep the UVs and you just give your 3p cockpit a much smaller texture (but essentially the same UVs/texture) than the 1p model.

Starting with the 3p model again, as you can see everything looks normal from the outside and on the inside everything looks all right just low rez (in fact textures could be much lower rez and I think in the full build they are, these files are not 100% upto date ) and the tri count is at 11,635 tris:





Now if we look at the 1p model we can see the interior has a bunch more tris, higher rez textures and the exterior faces are all removed and the tri count is at 4,915 tris:





Now if we look at the 3p textures we will see there are no cockpit textures on them:




We need to open the "3p cockpit texture sheet" in order to see them:


Where for the 1p model, you see the same sheet, just in much higher rez:


The way the Chinook has been modelled above (method "2") I personally wouldn't recommend. It is easier to make the model this way yes but its at the end of the day, performance wise it isn't as good.



Now instead of going into Helicopter cockpits going to take the landy here and show you what that's like since its more relevant to what your doing

So normal 3p model of the Landy at 9,289 tris.


Steering wheel is not very round and all interior textures are really low rez:


And switch to the 1p model and its a very different story, with it also having 4,067 tris.



Now if we look at the 3p textures you can see if you look really hard the interior textures just really low rez, if you can't see them just trust me, they are there:


and switch to the interior textures and we can ee the high rez interior. Also strangely enough for some reason many 3p textures are also on the interior texture. This really shouldn't be this way and it should be using the exterior textures off the 3p model unless some item really needs increased detail for the 1p model which I dont really see much need here other than a few small bits like this bit here right next to the driver:



But ye think you should get the idea here of what you need to do

[Snazz]

Nice work, PR could really do with more insurgent assets (and building statics).

Perhaps add a sunroof so a passenger can shoot from it, like the Libyans in Back to the Future:

[altfuture]

Wow, those examples were great! Nice to see how things look under the hood Thanks again. I understood it correctly and I will most probably go with the method 1, or a combination of 1 and 2 (having a minified 1p texture included in the sheet of the 3p model).

So, as Hauteclocque said, I don't need to worry about deleting invisible 3p faces from the 1p model, this will be taken care of by the export tool?

Nice work, PR could really do with more insurgent assets (and building statics).

Perhaps add a sunroof so a passenger can shoot from it, like the Libyans in Back to the Future:

I planned adding some cargo support on the roof like in the pic below, so that would probably not be possible. But, it's a good idea!

http://images.forum-auto.com/mesimages/ ... %20mkd.JPG

[Rhino]

So, as Hauteclocque said, I don't need to worry about deleting invisible 3p faces from the 1p model, this will be taken care of by the export tool?

Its best you delete all the unseen faces because tbh, most exporters can't model for sh*t and if you leave them any modelling to do they tend to screw up the models (no offence guys but its true )

So I would delete it all yourself

[altfuture]

rgr. I agree it's better to do it manually. It's more work, but heck, it's a lot of work anyway, so let's do it good. What's the chance of this getting into the 0.92 update? Any predictions of launching date?

[Rhino]

No chance of this going into .92

[Snazz]

I planned adding some cargo support on the roof like in the pic below, so that would probably not be possible. But, it's a good idea!

http://images.forum-auto.com/mesimages/ ... %20mkd.JPG

Ah ok, 2 versions maybe?

[Rhino]

Ah ok, 2 versions maybe?

ye, if your doing more than one colour 2 versions would be an idea, make the new texture more worth it