Why do people hate jets?

[mat552]

People don't like jets because jets don't like people. Fixed wing aircraft in PR are presented in such a manner that it makes it difficult to effectively support friendly ground forces with any consistency. It is by no means impossible to be a regularly good pilot, one to whom the team may always look to for support, but the peculiarities of flying in PR make it much more difficult than, for example, using armor, which easily translate into PR and integrate well.

If you want it, you can't get it. If you can get it, it can't find you. If it can find you, it can't identify the target. If it can identify the target, it can't hit it. But if it does hit the target, it doesn't do a great deal of damage anyway.

Communication is everything, and pilots are just as much at fault for the pervasive lack of communication as the rest of the team.

[Wh33lman]

from an infantry standpoint, they're annoying. for one, people fight over them and ruin the game. for 2, the jets are always crashed within 10 minutes and 11 tickets are gone, shorting a round.

its just easier for server admins to avoid the conflict altogether and not run jet maps.

[Psyko]

heh, i just realised we dont have any american jets. wouldnt that be an obvious next step? maybe F-22 raptors are too vanilla. sorry off topic.

[OSOK1LL3R]

heh, i just realised we dont have any american jets. wouldnt that be an obvious next step? maybe F-22 raptors are too vanilla. sorry off topic.

PR has the F16 and the A10 as american jets

[hobbnob]

I like jets, They are balanced against the AA threat and they can provide effective CAS when packaged with an experienced pilot. Trouble is, the pilots are often people who believe jets are vanilla-like in real life. They expect it to be realistic that they can warm up in seconds, take off within 50 meters and own all.
Now santa may be real but that's just plain wrong

[Shovel]

Go to a training server and learn how to do it, or get kicked/banned just as you would with any other asset.

What server bans you for crashing?

[Pedz]

I like jets, I don't like the people who waste 20mins from the start of the round waiting for them... Most servers do assets on squad basis, so if you've labeled the squad, you don't then need to wait for it like a 8 year old at Christmas... Go and help cap flags, assist an infantry squad, or do some transport... Even when the jets spawn and your halfway through a mission, don't suddenly turn back and run for the jet, it will be there when you get back, even if you wait 10mins longer than the original spawn time.

[Riflewizard]

I hate em, cuz they are too fast for such small maps, and never seem to help me at all. I'll call in a airstrike, and it either doesn't come or misses by epic proportions. In any case i figure im better off solving issues myself.

also as said they are almost certianly dead after a few mins.

[Target_Practice_117]

What server bans you for crashing?

There are a few... too many times a new pilot drops his bombs and crashes on landing... the A 10 is easy, the Tornado sorts the men from the boys.

[Sidewinder Zulu]

I think jets too often get a bad reputation through the faults of some vanilla newbies who have no idea what they're doing.

Because when you have a squad of good pilots, good spotters, and perhaps a commander helping you find targets with the UAV, you can totally destroy the opposing team.

Sure, tanks are good, and can absolutely help change the course of battle, and attack choppers can be formidable weapons as well.
But if you have two good pilots and some spotters lazing and killing targets, then it's not hard to make it impossible for the opposing team to render any real resistance aganist your side.

That can't really be said for any other asset in PR. Good pilots can be game-winners.

[Solid Knight]

I think jets are ill-suited for PR simply because the maps are too small. Hell, the maps are too small for attack helicopters too. It's the reason why they aren't on half the maps.

[Bringerof_D]

The map size isnt even that bad. I couldnt imagine it being practical any bigger. Ground troops would have a hell of a time getting around, and it would turn into another Kashan desert map.
The view distance limitation isnt even worth mentioning. You are a strategic asset sent in by intell you gain from your commander and SLs. Wait for intell, go in and drop a bomb, hit em up with some rockets/cannon, or wait for a laze. If you are skimming the ground looking for targets you must be suicidal, and not worthy of flying the jet in any server.
And I am quite sure the speed the jets travel are accurate. I have played several jet simulations and its pretty much the same game, just dumbed down a bit. The mechanics are all there, just not as many gadgets.
So um... yes, jets can and will work if they make a map that is fun for ground units to play as well.

that wasn't my point, the PR jets fly at an ok speed, i was talking about the Vanilla ones. they are ridiculously slow. Flight sim is one thing BF2 is another, it feels fast because you're flying under 300 feet whereas in a flight sim you're atleast 1000+ you simply cant fly the planes properly. I dont mean tactics, i mean the physical ability to maneuver. When i fly i fly following all the protocols and regulations a real pilot would have, that's why i dont fly in PR, it's simply not possible.

you're not supposed to know the plane was ever there till you've been hit by the missile, lets just say with this engine, you know they're there before they know you are

[Wh33lman]

well, misuse of the jets is another thing. flew with my friend on Kashan once. i had the A10, he had the F16. while i circled above the clouds to avoid the AA, he went on a bombing run trying to destroy their runway. of course he got shot down and i managed a little CAS while he was waiting for his plane to respawn. so it respawns, he gets back up and does the same thing. got shot down again. i flew untill like 10 minutes before the need of the round, successfully holding off the enemy renforcements bearing down on the MEC outpost untill friendly armor could arrive.

[Cassius]

I loove jets. So much fun bombing dogfighting or calling in airstrikes. Wait for it wait for it booom.

[Rhino]

he went on a bombing run trying to destroy their runway. of course he got shot down

Unless it was a really old version, it was a pretty pointless mission as you can't destroy there runways, been like that for quite a few versions now

[Arnoldio]

I dont hate jets. But all the stuff connected with them: Players (in most cases retards), limited airspace, kinda weird physics, no advanced targeting systems (as in CA).

Jets arent the problem, they are nice and fun.

[Murphy]

I think an issue is with a lot of players preconceived roles of a jet in PR. They jump into a fighter expecting to get into an air to air fight, but most of the time you're shot out of the sky by ground forces. It's also apparent that thanks to engine limitations air assets are best used as air to ground weapons rather then clearing air space. Air superiority is achieved by ground forces in PR, where as flight sims and real tactics have air power gaining their own superiority by taking out their competition beyond visual ranges (20-30 miles away), and striking enemy air power while it is still on the ground (base rape in pr).

Fighter pilots need not apply, the truly successful pilots (both Heli and Fixed wing) are flying CAS runs and allowing the infantry to keep the air space clear of threats.

[Solid Knight]

I think an issue is with a lot of players preconceived roles of a jet in PR. They jump into a fighter expecting to get into an air to air fight, but most of the time you're shot out of the sky by ground forces. It's also apparent that thanks to engine limitations air assets are best used as air to ground weapons rather then clearing air space. Air superiority is achieved by ground forces in PR, where as flight sims and real tactics have air power gaining their own superiority by taking out their competition beyond visual ranges (20-30 miles away), and striking enemy air power while it is still on the ground (base rape in pr).

Fighter pilots need not apply, the truly successful pilots (both Heli and Fixed wing) are flying CAS runs and allowing the infantry to keep the air space clear of threats.

Because the maps aren't big enough (and can't be big enough). BF2 is more suited to infantry + medium to light armor. Sometimes helicopters make sense.

However attack helicopters can't perform their roll that well given their inability to leverage their real advantages (as far as real life goes). And jets are too few for real dog fights and the maps are too small for real air strikes.

[CBCRonin]

However attack helicopters can't perform their roll that well given their inability to leverage their real advantages (as far as real life goes).

This is due to ineffective squads though, not really to the equipment available. If a fully crewed Kiowa actually works in tandum with the Apache, the attack chopper becomes the most powerful weapon on the battlefield.

[Kiowa lazes from behind hills, Apache pops up and fires LT hellfire, Apache immediately ducks back down.]

It would of'course be nice to have that radar array on the Longbow be more than show, but proper team work easily compensates.
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Urban warfare is where the attack chopper is really at a disadvantage. Sure the gunner has thermal, but the window is small and scanning takes time..... usually just enough for an AA kit, AA veh., or an AA emplacement to lock on.
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I'm not sure of the experiences that some have had with Jets, but I have seen games where our side maintained air superiority throughout the match..... directly due to the piloting of fighter jets.

Maybe it was because our Heli CAS aided in removal of any aa veh., but those guys were quite skillful.

[tntkid22]

I think its the misuse of the aircraft.

Personally one of them most beautiful things in PR is lasing enemy armor hitting a friendly flag, hearing/reading the bombs away and the direct hit explosion a10 flies over you everyone throws a party till we get flanked.

I never seem to have a problem with fixed wing, just wait till you have targets, clear air space, get away from aa and you can live for pretty much the whole round.


The thing i dont understand tho, but Ive seen time and time again, is this:


You just downloaded PR. You somehow found out about it without reading ANYTHING about it so you have NO IDEA how anything works (deviation, warm up times, etc) and you go into a heli try to take off crash, call this mod the abomination of the world and promptly uninstall.

How are people that ignorant? to not even read the manual placed on their desktop...or check out some of the mechanics on the site?