3-Round Burst is pointless.

[Bringerof_D]

In real life, TRB was created for the American troops in Vietnam. The developers of the M16 realized the full auto had become useless in the thick jungle, since panic-struct troops would just empty the clip uncontrollably at the air surrounding the Vietcong. Therefore, they invented the TRB as a way to 'force' the troops to take at least some time to aim.

I do not know how the American troops IRL are trained, but I know for a fact that other nationalities aren't being trained to use full auto at all. A riffle such as the M16, M4, any 5.56 riffle really, is simply not build for average troops to fire full auto at anything else than close quarters, meaning way less than 50 meters.

In PR I don't think burst is rubbish or useless, but it does have a very limited use.

I dont know about you but Canada's soldeirs are trained to fire our C7s on auto, it's part of the qualification requirements. That said we are also trained to decide when we need it. So we rarely ever use it unless we need it. We did Urban ops training for my unit just last year and honestly most times we stuck with semi auto. the only time i recall switching to full was when we needed to really take down our warrant on the bus XD. Dude just wouldnt go down unless we covered him with welts and tackled him.

Conervation of ammo is important enough to warrant the 3-round burst.

that i do agree with, i just feel that auto fire (IRL i mean) does a better job than 3RB when it comes to fighting. you have better control and less chance of a stoppage, as we know the 3 rd burst function on the m16 as far as i've been told is flawed (could be the same for others as as well.) where if you let go of the trigger before all 3 rounds are fired, your next trigger pull will only let off what was left of the last burst. meaning if you fired 2 of 3, next pull you only get 1. this can be a deadly flaw. In game though it works just as well as auto if not better depending on what kind of user you are. i dont mind either but i do prefer letting off a burst of 5 rather than 3

[Mikemonster]

Hmm, some good advice again and good response, cheers guys. I use 3RB if I have my scopes up, sometimes it is totally impractical to move with them up though.

Also, realistically you cannot grenade every room you want to enter, added to this is the fact that any good plaer will simply walk around the corner and return when the grenade has exploded, to cover the doorway. Or if it's fairly far away will remain prone and accept that he will have to use your patch after he's killed you.

Practise practise practise for me when I get my PC set up next week and play with you all again. I actually love skirmish, we'll see how it goes.

[Lange]

Burst fire sucks **** in PR and i've analyzed it a lot after being active in the game for a year and a half. Its horrible the bullets spread way to much and Mike your first post pretty much sums it up

As per the title really.. At extreme close range you usually get one or two hits but the low calibre means that only a lucky headshot will actually drop the enemy. In the meanwhile they will kill you and then use your patch and their patch and run off merrily on their way.

I originally thought that Burst was used by soldiers to hit running targets at ranges of about 50 metres. But in PR more often than not the first bullet will hit and the next two will beautifully frame the enemy soldier but harmlessly whizz past him. Then on the next burst you are even less accurate. I find I am actually guaranteed only one hit even after full settle time, which makes the whole thing pointless because I could fire two quick shots instead and actually stand to kill the enemy.

I understand there is a theory of 'get more lead in the air' vs aimed shots, but in PR it is either a hit or a miss. And with burst it's usually one hit and two [close] misses. The enemy won't flinch as you miss him and it won't spoil his aim.

In CQB it is a total joke.. as mentioned if you don't get a headshot you are screwed, because they can just hold the trigger in in full auto and chainsaw you.

Anyone else find this? I just hate those silly guns. And on the ironsights M16 the end sight is really really thick, cartoonish even.

I have no idea how anyone feels the burst is ok in PR. Im not saying it doesn't work at all but its extremely random and ineffective. Unless you spam a bunch of shots most of the time in CQC your screwed and even then your pwned in the face by the enemy who can fire MORE accurate and more powerful shots at that.

It only works at all within extreme range of <30 M over that its basic useless unless you sit there and try to recoil adjust then maybe the deviation will score a lucky hit. Let me ask you this though is there ever time to recoil adjust when you encounter enemy in CBC? No, when you see a enemy in a quick scenario around the corner you can't always sit there and use the effort to recoil compensate so guess what, in most cases you've lost.

It wouldn't be a problem if the burst was actually accurate due to its low damage meaning 3 shots to drop a armored target 2 for an insurgent. However, most of the time with a burst fired your lucky to land 1 at all or 2 if it is extreme luck so the enemy just drops you quick.

Heck you can even be strafed shot by guys with AKs but oh no that's impossible with the M16 family all you'll do is firecracker all around the guy while you get pwned in the face, heck you miss burst shots sitting there settled half the time.

In my experience, other than the QBZ which seems to be fairly reliable in CQC, all the 5.56 guns on auto have wierd spread for some reason and suck for CQC, including the L85 and C7, which are rediculous the AK works much better and has a tighter grouping of bullets it would seem.

And don't tell me the whole deviation story, I know the guns all have the same deviation but there is different reactions with each, I actually have tried to tweak the deviation code to experiment with guns on auto especially the M16 so please don't even go there.

And off topic the M4 iron is exactly what you said it to be I have no idea why they just don't use the M16 iron which is a lot better.

[KaizerSosa81]

I'm still pretty fresh to PR, but my experience with burst has been overwhelmingly positive for the most part. Of course when I utilize it, its under certain circumstances.

Mostly defense positions in places where I can funnel bait my enemy into staircases and doorways. In such cases burst is indeed useful, but it's usefulness is limited.

I'm completely fine with it at the moment though.

[TmanEd]

I never understood why people hate 3RB in games so much in general. I can understand it if it's something shitty like CoD that has some kind of forced delay after you shoot, but in BF2 and PR it's basically full-auto firepower that you have to click a bit more to achieve.

[TheComedian]

I have no idea how anyone feels the burst is ok in PR. Im not saying it doesn't work at all but its extremely random and ineffective. Unless you spam a bunch of shots most of the time in CQC your screwed and even then your pwned in the face by the enemy who can fire MORE accurate and more powerful shots at that.

Well automatic fire IS spamming bullets so any problem here?
Oh and compared to the G3 on full auto the recoil is next to nothing.

It only works at all within extreme range of <30 M over that its basic useless

All automatic fire is useless beyond 30m

unless you sit there and try to recoil adjust then maybe the deviation will score a lucky hit. Let me ask you this though is there ever time to recoil adjust when you encounter enemy in CBC? No, when you see a enemy in a quick scenario around the corner you can't always sit there and use the effort to recoil compensate so guess what, in most cases you've lost.

Here is just a case of bad experience

In my experience, other than the QBZ which seems to be fairly reliable in CQC, all the 5.56 guns on auto have wierd spread for some reason and suck for CQC, including the L85 and C7, which are rediculous the AK works much better and has a tighter grouping of bullets it would seem.

Thats the recoil talking.

[MacGyver_]

I can understand how you'd think that, but 3 round burst really is great, especially in CQC. 3 rounds in the chest will kill, but often the first round will hit the chest and recoil will cause the other two rounds to hit the head/neck area. Try and incorporate that next time you use it.

[Leopardi]

the only situation burst is useful is when you are proning and waiting for enemy to come in the doorway. Other times the random deviation just ruins it.

[Brainlaag]

the only situation burst is useful is when you are proning and waiting for enemy to come in the doorway. Other times the random deviation just ruins it.

Actually right after running, thats the worst situation for Burst. After you double tap your LMB the devation jumps on max (or very high) independent from your current position.

Here you can see the benefits of burst fire, the first 6 shots land always where you want them, ALWAYS.

[Mikemonster]

Had a guy on Kokan skirmish last night fire four bursts at me as I waited for the Medic gun deviation to settle. He killed me just before I got my shot off, but it was a close one (I reckon within about 15 millisecs). I could really feel his panic after the first two bursts missed! Lol.

Some of the 'problem' is that unlike Full-Auto you cannot gauge very well where the centre of your screen is (when hip firing, which is my problem area with burst). Because only 3 shots land there is no 'cone of fire' to center the enemy in.

[Brainlaag]

Had a guy on Kokan skirmish last night fire four bursts at me as I waited for the Medic gun deviation to settle. He killed me just before I got my shot off, but it was a close one (I reckon within about 15 millisecs). I could really feel his panic after the first two bursts missed! Lol.

Some of the 'problem' is that unlike Full-Auto you cannot gauge very well where the centre of your screen is (when hip firing, which is my problem area with burst). Because only 3 shots land there is no 'cone of fire' to center the enemy in.

Well hipfiring is very often a 50-50 situation.

[mangeface]

H[=Rissien;1608932']If you dont like the burst dont use it, simple really. Army and Marines use A2's and A4's which are semi and burst. So thats whats in game.

Actually, we don't have M16A2s in the USMC anymore. Even the recruit training depots have upgraded to iron sight M16A4s. M16A4s are used sparsely by the infantry, but they primarily use M4s. M16A4s are hefted by rear echlon units, like air wingers and logistic battalions.

On topic, I like the 3 round burst. Using it past 30 or so meters is pointless, but I feel it's better than automatic in CQB since you can point towards the pelvic area of your enemy and more than likely the rounds will walk up, but still hit. There are a few exceptions where full auto is better than the 3 round burst, but it's a hell of a lot better than having to slam your mouse button numerous times for single shot.

[Herbiie]

Anyone else find this? I just hate those silly guns. And on the ironsights M16 the end sight is really really thick, cartoonish even.

Take it up with the US Army - whether you like it or not it's still what is used & has no place in the "feedback" forums imho (The tactics forums, that's different).

[Maverick]

Appreciate the rant, and the opinion, but 3 round burst isn't pointless. Don't like it? Don't use it. The Army uses burst/semi and so does the USMC. Get over it. Don't like it? don't use it. Also the M4 and M16 are NOT "silly guns" That's kid talk. They are RIFLES.

[BulletPr0of]

In my experiences, the Gun is not the issue, firing three rounds at the enemy is enough to drop him, the issue is with the hit registration, not every round you fire registers, by the time you get your second burst off the guy with the AK has probably fired maybe two more bullets than you have. However I'd still take the m4/m16 over a g3 in close quarters for the same reason, the power behind the g3 is unquestionable, but when only a percentage of rounds register rate of fire wins in most scenarios, obviously with exceptions. Take the TARs and m4a1's generally speaking, if you see any enemy he's dead simply because of the amount of rounds you can get off, which avoids any hit registration issues.

[Cpt Donegan]

I just can't stand rifles. Since starting in '09 I've probably gotten 100 kills with rifles, the rest with other weapons.

[Bluedrake42]

you don't understand the point of the weapon, 3 round burst is purely for suppression, don't use that for accurate fire

If you use full auto for suppression... it works great for like... 3 seconds until you run out of ammo and have to reload

3 round burst supplies the most adequate amount of suppression for the maximum amount of time

[AquaticPenguin]

3 round burst supplies the most adequate amount of suppression for the maximum amount of time

Disagree, 3-round-burst is a big waste of ammo for suppression. At a range the first round will help suppress, but the 2nd and 3rd rounds will be hitting in the suppression time of the first, and they'll be less accurate. Firing rapidly in single fire would be much more effective, since it'll space the shots out more.

[Mikemonster]

Take it up with the US Army - whether you like it or not it's still what is used & has no place in the "feedback" forums imho (The tactics forums, that's different).

It's still feedback mate. The sight I believe is low-res and very thick. I have actually sent various letters to both USMC and US Army Cheifs of Staff and so far got no replies and I am a VERY insistent person so it is surely only a matter of time before the guns are changed to suit my wishes and PR will have to follow! Good day to you sir!

Appreciate the rant, and the opinion, but 3 round burst isn't pointless. Don't like it? Don't use it. The Army uses burst/semi and so does the USMC. Get over it. Don't like it? don't use it. Also the M4 and M16 are NOT "silly guns" That's kid talk. They are RIFLES.

With respect, in the greater scheme of things, they are fairly silly guns. PR gameplay needs unfortunately mean that you can shoot someone as they run accross the road and the low calibre means they patch up to 100% health and carry on (usually me, with a big grin on my face thanking God and all the other ones).

Deffo wouldn't like to get shot by one in real life though, agreed!