No more bird watching?

[Rudd]

apparently that's what you were indicating

[ComradeHX]

apparently that's what you were indicating

Apparently you thought wrong.

I was indicating that having no binos = needless action(calling teammate to look at it) = two people killed.

Normally if rest of squad is not visible; it is just ONE who will get hit.

Or it could be that due to low resolution or whatever reason; the one that is supposed to cover that sector MISSED the deployed AR entirely, causing his entire squad killed.
All because of monitor resolution(because IRL it would be possible to see more than just pixels of blended colors). So real...

If that was 500m+, it would be perfectly reasonable. But in PR, it happens at much lower distance.

Someone should just confirm that Blufor ironsight kits will have binos so people will know that those kits are playable/not at severe disadvantage.
-------------------------------
Realism wise; does any military BAN ownership of binoculars?

If not then most soldiers IRL would probably have one if they have bad vision like looking through a monitor.

I am sure PR 1.0v is not going to be that bad.

[Rudd]

Being killed by an AR while guiding your squad's fire in isn't very common in my experience, I generally try and spot for my squad already, standing near them, watching their tracers with my GLTD (or binocs and watch bullet impacts on insurgency)

Its usually the sniper you didn't see that'll get ya in those instances, and that's the danger at any point in the game.

[Spush]

Just check your maps, if you want to see if you have friendlies in that sector your scanning, it's very simple, has worked for me in the past 5 years of playing PR and thus I hardly ever get a teamkill.

Binoculars are mainly restricted to Squad Leaders, Fireteam Leaders, Platoon Leaders, and Vehicle Commanders (in our case Crewman Kit), according to our MA's.

I'm rather done talking about this subject because it's not game breaking.

[Piipu]

So you think as developers of a reality mod that removing binoculars and forcing everyone to check their teammates from a magical map that contains real-time information is realistic? I'm just slightly confused here.
Kinda like how the RPG-7 trajectories were changed to resemble some throwing a stone at the enemy rather than for example a rocket. I'm not sure what you think realism is but it is not this.

[PlaynCool]

^ Have you heard of GPS? Also i too agree there should be some zoom for iron sights but 2x is too much
maybe 1.2x or 1.3x . Really i would love to see optics removed from the ordinary grunt.

[Piipu]

Have you heard of soldiers actually using such things as acogs and binoculars? Because I have. I have not heard of a map that updates every soldier's position through GPS though. Maybe that's what the US army uses, I wouldn't know.
Edit: Also, why are you suggesting that we add some unrealistic zoom to iron sights to allow people to shoot further when you could just keep the optics as they are since they seem to work pretty well.

[AfterDune]

We're not going to discuss this further. Comment on it when you've actually played a while.

[PlaynCool]

Well IRL you can always ask command for positions on friendly troops.I'm pretty sure most of the modern armies use the GPS extensively after all it was the US army who invented it no?Thus the "magic" map is not so unrealistic.Why would 1.2x zoom be unrealistic? You wouldn't even notice it and it would help soldiers sight on to more distant targets, to simulate the fact that IRL your eyes can focus on objects.

[Midnight_o9]

On the other hand... on the screen, you'll see a black pixel moving... IRL, a soldier in the distance with modern camo... you'll hardly see anything...
You guys have to balance things out, and the best solution for now is to wait and see... if it's really unplayable they'll change it, it's not the first time they do some mistakes with the changes but it's always corrected, at least they try to innovate. You certainly are the same guys who think the game is dying because of the lack of updates but when changes come you complain about it even before you tried it.

[Pvt.LHeureux]

Sorry guys but as a normal soldier grunt in real life it's useless to have binoculars, so they don't get them. The squad leader will call targets and where to shoot at and you shoot where he says, just like in real life, you won't see a whole squad looking at the enemy with binoculars instead of shooting them.

[Wicca]

Ermaghewd they ruined the mod. God damn it!



Southpark - They Took Our Job! - YouTube

THey TOOK OUR MOD!


DERKA DERK.

God u guys need to chill and just play

[40mmrain]

Sorry guys but as a normal soldier grunt in real life it's useless to have binoculars, so they don't get them. The squad leader will call targets and where to shoot at and you shoot where he says, just like in real life, you won't see a whole squad looking at the enemy with binoculars instead of shooting them.

illogic ****. The nature of vision of actual space, and viewing a screen depicting 3 space is demonstrably different, and thus requires dynamic FOV changes to actually function realistically. An ability to zoom is absolutely necessary for realistic depiction of the ability to fucking see. I will draw some nice pictures to show this, when I find time.

[K4on]

mate, there are still kits with binocs. and for kits that don't have 'em, you can still take a scope variant of that rifle.
take it easy.

[Pvt.LHeureux]

illogic ****. The nature of vision of actual space, and viewing a screen depicting 3 space is demonstrably different, and thus requires dynamic FOV changes to actually function realistically. An ability to zoom is absolutely necessary for realistic depiction of the ability to fucking see. I will draw some nice pictures to show this, when I find time.

I know what you mean, here, have a look at what I wrote for defending the Red Orchestra 2 zoom feature, the images are gone sadly :

A better explaination of the zoom feature. - Tripwire Interactive Forums

So yes, using a zoom feature is "Taking scales to normal human eye distinctions"

As a real life human you would ALWAYS see zoomed in but with a bigger peripheral vision (I know you know that)

Good quote :

Your computer monitor has to represent your full vision scale, including peripheral, on a small 2D plane. It does this by zooming your view out so you can see more. Pressing the zoom key brings objects into NORMAL scale, the scale that you can see in real life, with full peripheral vision and everything. It is getting rid of the artificial peripheral that the computer has added in to prevent you from being oblivious.

But the thing is that PR doesn't have a zoom feature but binoculars instead, that is the bad part, because having the binos replacing a zoom feature makes it unrealistic because :

1. Not all troops are issued binos
2. You would not always look in your binos like it happens in PR currently


Also as you can see in this video, nobody is scanning for enemies with binoculars :



^ This is how the current war is fought, you shoot at where the enemy fire is comming from or where your chiefs say you to shoot at 400m+ not knowing what the hell is happening on the receiving hand

NOW the 2nd problem is that PR uses the BF2 engine which is 7 years old and does not have super awesome draw distances and LODs and graphics, so in PR you don't really need a zoom feature because it's actually easier to spot enemies while unzoomed because some things won't appear at the distance or trees will have less leaves, etc (REALLY apparent on Fools Road).

Also not sure if a zoom feature is possible on this engine and anyway most conventional factions have scopes on their rifles in PR + not all kits will lose their binos.

[40mmrain]

Right, I have no problem with getting rid of the actual binoculars, but just some way to zoom is necessary, I see now you get that.

I'd say that unconvetionals with binos, and conventionals with scopes is good enough, but at that point the iron sight kits become pretty hard to make useful especially with BUIS.

Still think the pseudo BUIS for a red dot where you can alternate between 2x and 1x is workable, still would be useful against the ACOG with a little red dot on top, because the acog would be rather obtrusive in close combat, and a fully zoomed out red dot would be the most unobtrusive and nonabrasive weapon. This would go well with falklands, vietnam, and normandy too, the grunts need something

[Pvt.LHeureux]

Yeah actually an option to switch between zoom levels or between the scope/iron sights is possible and might be put in. But it's also cool to have some iron sights weapons only sometimes

[ComradeHX]

Sorry guys but as a normal soldier grunt in real life it's useless to have binoculars, so they don't get them. The squad leader will call targets and where to shoot at and you shoot where he says, just like in real life, you won't see a whole squad looking at the enemy with binoculars instead of shooting them.

I doubt your vision is as bad as if looking through a low-res monitor. XD

[Cassius]

If its not realistic that every grunt gets binos, then thats the way it should be done.

This is how the current war is fought, you shoot at where the enemy fire is comming from or where your chiefs say you to shoot at 400m+ not knowing what the hell is happening on the receiving hand

It depends on where you are. In modern wars most causalities are inflicted by ordnance air support etc. except for city fights maybe. Your rifle is for self defense mostly. You hold ground locate the enemy direct armor artillery cas etc. The only reason mortars are so underpowered in PR is that a wooden shack is sufficient cover.

Of course in like Africa there are wars where an ak47 and a techie is as high tech as it gets.

[Curry]

Any zoom is bad zoom, at least for grunts.

Curry.