[Brainstorm] Harsher Collaborator RoE Punishments in Insurgency (Per Player)

[Murphy]

All this effort is going towards policing the bluguys - what really needs to change is the behavior of civilians from the get go. Please keep in mind with any of these changes you are just going to further strengthen the retarded tactics used by civis.

Running into fire being the most obvious, but lets not forget the tactic of being hit once then running away and dropping your kit to give the unwitting blu guy a civi kill.

The kits are the most exploited part of the game and frankly I have been patiently waiting their removal for a very long time, but people seem to believe it fits into the whole "reality" theme even though it's far from the truth in-game.

[Arab]

All this effort is going towards policing the bluguys - what really needs to change is the behavior of civilians from the get go. Please keep in mind with any of these changes you are just going to further strengthen the retarded tactics used by civis.

Running into fire being the most obvious, but lets not forget the tactic of being hit once then running away and dropping your kit to give the unwitting blu guy a civi kill.

The kits are the most exploited part of the game and frankly I have been patiently waiting their removal for a very long time, but people seem to believe it fits into the whole "reality" theme even though it's far from the truth in-game.

I agree with this!
Prevent all Insurgents from dropping their kits, and allow them to only pickup gun kits.

Any Insurgent cannot simply drop his kit to be an unarmed civillian. (I don't know if there's a way that Blueforce could see Insurgents dropping their kits, and them firing would count as an intelligence point)

Although it is funny to see Collaborators wave their hands while being Taxied to a place, it should only be kept to that class.

+1


I like the idea of this, however, I think it needs to be thought out a bit more. Perhaps adding a surrender commo-rose option that the blufor can use? The blufor would have to use this surrender button before they are allowed to arrest a civi. The civi has two options at this point; surrender and he either gets no penalty or reduced penalties depending on the conditions, or he can resist by running in which case he'll receive a penalty.
I've made a quick table for what I think good penalties would be.



Ps. I just realised I failed with my screen cap as there is a box floating on the top of the table

+1 It'd be nice to do something other than getting shot.

+1 for the Surrender Suggestion

I don't know if this is discussing the issue, or my posts are for Suggestions.

[Arab]

delete, double-post

[Pvt.LHeureux]

I agree with this!
Prevent all Insurgents from dropping their kits, and allow them to only pickup gun kits.

This wouldn't work because there is always bugs, where your kit might disapear in the ground while you have an enemy kit and you are doomed to die, also dropping kits is the best way to exchange kits, etc.

[Arab]

This wouldn't work because there is always bugs, where your kit might disapear in the ground while you have an enemy kit and you are doomed to die, also dropping kits is the best way to exchange kits, etc.

+1 Screen Blackout

I have made that suggestion about a switch kit option and that to the Suggestion Sub-Forum, so it doesn't belong here exactly...

[Pesticide]

wound the infracting player instantly when shooting at a civie, so he needs to run to his medic. effectively putting him out of combat and being a burden on his team

[Heavy Death]

Denial of limited kits, after you shoot a civie... No more Mr. AR for you sir.

[PoisonBill]

+1 To punishment of the whole team, that being: -5 tickets/+5 seconds spawntime (Or a mix of that/different figures)

[C.Death[3rdID]]

I got an idea. Remove this kit from the mod to forever end it's abuse and give the rope/medkit to the insurgent shotgun class. You may ask why but I mean come on, is it not strange to have people climbing up ropes while on their "daily stroll"? How about remove the rope from that kit?

As for punishments nothing will piss you off more than having a great game of PR with lots of team points just to lose them all because a civilian was in the crossfire of a fire fight and was tossing rocks at someone like an ape throws excrement.
Anyway, I think that any harsher punishment isn't needed. In fact, there should be less of an infraction for killing just one of these guys.

+25 second respawn time per civilian killed. -(current intel lost) intel per civilian killed (Not including factors like if they spawned on a cache or hideout, etc.. just in general)

Better yet:
If a civilian is shot by the BLUFOR for damaging a BLUFOR player with rocks. One OPFOR weapons cache explodes and the civilian is given a 300 second spawn time and upon respawn is promptly given a swift kick to the nuts by an admin. The admin is notified by a large ORANGE server message that appears upon the civilian being killed.

[Murphy]

I got an idea. Remove this kit from the mod

I have wanted this for sooo long. I understand it does fill a role, but it does a very poor job at it. The mechanics are to exploitable, they feel like they were made to be exploited by players.

Sure it is indeed loads of fun to be the civi, but at the same time I know how damned frustrating it is to get your wig split by a guy who was watching you for 2-3 minutes. I also see the reasoning behind a kit that focuses on gathering intel as well as keeping your teammates alive and getting them to sneaky spots. It's a great kit for the guys playing as insurgents but for everyone else playing it is just bad.

[Heavy Death]

See guys... thats the point of insurgency (to those who want to remove picking up/dropping kits). In real life, a guy can shoot at you one second, go behind the building, drop the ak and instantly becomes an unarmed civilian. PR has an easy version of 30 seconds, if not a minute for that to happen. So, that tactic kinda is a part of insurgency, even though its not used much.

Civi kit must be changed in some way. Maybe for every item except hands and rocks, they should go in helping mode. Probably not the most realistic option, but its an old game with restrictions... requires some imagination to see things realistically;
Use of the rope=letting insurgents into your apartment/house to gain access to the roof,
medkit/patches=administering first aid,
cellphone=possible IED detonation device/reporting enemy positions,
binocs=reporting enemy positions

[billysmall44]

I know someone already suggested this, but keep in mind that mortars kill civilians ALL the time. What if we could create something like this: Any civilian within X amount of meters of a vehicle that you are driving (Gunning) can be killed without punishment. Infantry cannot engage civilians with firearms. If they do, the only way its justifiable without consequences is if A:Civilian has administered first aid within the last X amount of time B: The civilian has switched kits, or dropped their kit under X amount of time.

The punishment being like a substantial amount of tickets lost+a longer spawn time. It forces people to think about their actions more, due to the fact that they are not only affecting their spawn time, but they are ruining the teams ticket count. I think it could also make the specialist kit more used as well as handcuffs. Them being the ONLY way they can get rid of pesky civilians with no consequences.

Moving on to civilian consequences. If they are arrested, the bluefor gain substantial intel, or logistic points or whatever used for revealing caches+longer spawn time. If they are killed while in the act of terrorism (first aid, swapping kits) then they have a longer spawn time but no lose of intel. This idea would stress the idea of arresting civilians instead of killing them, due to the benefit the bluefor would receive.

Aircraft cannot justifiably kill civilians, no matter what.

I hope some of my ideas helped

[40mmrain]

S In real life, a guy can shoot at you one second, go behind the building, drop the ak and instantly becomes an unarmed civilian.

do you honestly think that's the truth? Lol.

In general the civi is terribly unrealistic, annoying, and doesnt work. Actual completely unequipped civilians run the hell away from combat zones in iraq. APaches dont hesitate to annihilate large groups of people with only a couple aks or 1 rpg tube between of them. In game, bleeding out in the water, shot for having an epipen, but not for spotting with binos, etc. is hilarious. Insurgents rarely have medics either as a result, too.

I'm in favour of absolute removal, I kill civis on sight, as I wont have my squad killed as a result of a broken game mechanic.

[billysmall44]

The main problem is this: We all know civilians are not actually civilians. They are Opfor.

[40mmrain]

people ducking and popping their heads up with binoculars are assumed as OPFOR regardless in real life.

I listened to a story told by a canadian leopard gunner I talked to about how he was given the go ahead to engag, and kill a taliban mortar spotter who was unarmed and behaving almost exactly like a PR civi.

The difference he was allowed to shoot the civi, lol.

[rodrigoma]

so ... the point is, it is unrealistic because in real life war US dont follow any rules of engagement and just outright kill anyone anywhere, seems correct

[SShadowFox]

Remove the civilians and give the Insurgents the same the Taliban and the Militia have: a Combat Medic, simple like this.

[Psyrus]

Sigh... there goes my thread. It was a thread directed at a specific gathering of ideas, supposed to be presented in a specific type of way. Not a discussion thread.

Can it be locked now? It clearly has been derailed by people who didn't bother to read the OP.