Complaining

[EagleEyeLG]

There is NOTHING wrong with spawn killing as long as it isn't an uncappable spawn. When I'm trying to cap your flag, and I see you spawn, I'm not going to give you a chance, I'm going to shoot you.

I think that's what everyone means. Obviously you're not going to just let your enemies walk around you when you're trying to cap a flag.

[.:iGi:. Greg]

I agree with everypoint except for saying thanks. If you are in some crazy firefight I really could care less if the guy says thanks or not as sometimes it's just a ***** trying to hit the right word command when you could potentially get shot to shit again.

That comment shows another problem. When you revive someone and they just run away bleeding to death.

You should have time to say thanks because you should be hiding next to the medic as he fully heals you.

The amount of times I have revived someone only to see them run off with a tiny bit of health and drop dead shortly after is amazing.

[Augustus]

Rhino']we can only mod the game, we cant mod the players

Modding the game does mod the players, if you do it properly.

[bosco_]

Modding the game does mod the players, if you do it properly.

Explanation please.

[.:iGi:. Sidd77]

The M4 is a excellent rifle in single shot, most of the time i use it as a snipe rifle than a CQB weapon anyway how do you know that the M4 is overpowered? i think its not the M4 thats the problem its the fact that it aint a request kit so in the next release i think it should be a request kit, this will put a end to the *M4 whoring* that its come to be known although i generally dont give a flying **** what other people say or think i just play for the laughs and teamwork that PR brings... unless you've got a side full of vanilla schweinz then it can be ****.

[mammikoura]

The M4 is a excellent rifle in single shot, most of the time i use it as a snipe rifle than a CQB weapon anyway how do you know that the M4 is overpowered? i think its not the M4 thats the problem its the fact that it aint a request kit so in the next release i think it should be a request kit, this will put a end to the *M4 whoring* that its come to be known although i generally dont give a flying **** what other people say or think i just play for the laughs and teamwork that PR brings... unless you've got a side full of vanilla schweinz then it can be ****.

yeah, I wouldn't mind the fact that it's better if it was limited. But as I said, right now I see about 50% of the US guys being spec ops...

There is NOTHING wrong with spawn killing as long as it isn't an uncappable spawn. When I'm trying to cap your flag, and I see you spawn, I'm not going to give you a chance, I'm going to shoot you.

Of course you are going to kill them if you are taking the spawn.
Thats why I said:
"Of course you might have to kill someone who just spawned when you are taking a flag or covering guys who are taking flags, but to see a lot of people camping inside uncappable spawns is just plain wrong"

[MMad]

M4 whoring
Yes it is the best weapon in the game right now. Does it mean that it's the only weapon you can use? [...] Why can't people understand that this mod is supposed to be about teamwork, not your k/d ratio.

The game is all about winning the round, through skill and teamwork. If one weapon and kit is decidely superior, anyone playing to win (as I do) will choose that weapon. Complaining about this fact is silly, imo. Might as well complain about people being mean and taking your flags.

The game is perfectly balanced when the optimal way to win is to optimize teamplay.

tk punishing
Now punishing is a good system if used correctly. The thing that pisses me off is that there are a lot of people who punish from every single teamkill.[...] Whats the point in that?
What I do when I get teamkilled is, if it's clearly intentional, or just plain idiotic then I punish. If I have no idea how/why I was tk'd I wait for a moment. If he says he is sorry, I forgive, if he doesn't then I'll usually punish him. But if I can see that it's an accident (like someone throwing a grenade and it hits a tree/door/window frame or I'm right next to an enemy I forgive every single time because he didn't mean to kill me.

On the topic of TK punishing, I think my opinion differs from most people here... Back in vBF2, I used to reason the way you did: intentional teamkills or truly idiotic behaviour got punished, accidental and understandable teamkills were always forgiven. However, in PR I think the rules are entirely different, and I punish almost every time I get TK'ed.

PR is supposed to be a much more realistic and tactical game than vBF2 ever was, and part of that difference should be about making teamkilling much less acceptable. If a real life soldier, even a experienced and distinguished one, accidentally shot a squadmate and as his only defense said "I thought he looked like an enemy", do you think his superiors would find that good enough? In a real combat scenario any disciplined soldier should verify his target; if there is *any* uncertainty, he should hold fire.

This principle is applied in America's Army, for example, were some servers auto-kick people for even a single teamkill. IIRC there are even servers auto-kicking for team damage.. Obviously PR is not nearly that hardcore, but the point I'm trying to make is that there really is no excuse for most accidental TKs happening in this game. Every single bullet leaving your rifle, ever grenade you launch or throw is your responsibility. If you frag the wrong guy, for whatever reason, you messed up and should accept that punishing you is entirely acceptable. If the other guy forgives you, fine, that's his choice, but he has every right to punish you.

As I said, I punish pretty much all TKs unless I feel I was to blame - running in front of someone firing or in front of a vehicle really doesn't give the killer a chance to help himself, and that is another thing entirely. But if I'm running behind enemy lines and a friendly appears around a corner, panics and shoots me, NO WAY am I going to forgive that.

In fact, I think TK punishes should be made even harsher, like 2 punishes or maybe just 1 would lead to an autokick. Or a punish could lead to the killer being instantly killed.. seems an appropriate punishment tbh, no more unrealistic than many other gamey elements in PR and perfectly in the spirit of the game, IMO. You reap what you sow; that other guy's gonna have to wait 45 seconds until he can continue playing, due to your mistake. It's only fair that you get to wait with him.

All that said, TKs aren't really that common in PR anymore. Usually it only happens to me maybe once in a round, and it usually goes several rounds between my TKs. So I really don't think it's a major point either way.

There is NOTHING wrong with spawn killing as long as it isn't an uncappable spawn. When I'm trying to cap your flag, and I see you spawn, I'm not going to give you a chance, I'm going to shoot you.

Exactly true. The problem is really one of level design - if the spawnpoints are placed in such a way that you're likely to see people spawn when assaulting the flags, or if there's few enough of them that you can learn where they are and camp them, that's the level creator's fault. The worst example ever is the Hotel flag on Strike at Karkand. There's only, what, four different spawnpoints on that flag, and a correctly places APC can cover two of them, instantly killing half the people spawning there before they have a chance to react. If that flag had twice as many spawnpoints, spread over a larger area and more out of the way, the total sum of spawnkilling frustration in vBF2 as a whole would probably decrease significantly..

I do hope PR mapmakers are aware of these factors and place spawnpoints appropriately.

Oh, and uncappable flags should never even be approachable by the enemy, IMO. There's just no good reason to allow it.

[.:iGi:. Eggenberg4Ever]

As to the medic issue, I tend only to medic guys in my squad. Last night, at one stage, I had 2 kills/12 deaths but my squad was top squad at the end AND we won the map. My defib & medi-pack were in my hands more than my rifle.
If there's a non squad member close by that needs revived or 1st aid then fair enough; I'll do the right thing. But I'm not gonna sprint across a fire zone to revive someone not in my squad: that's a job for their squad medic/s & if they don't have one in their squad then that's down to poor SL management. Half the time they've wandered away from the body of their squad on a gung-ho-solo anyway so tough titty.
Stick with your squad & if you're SL make sure someone's gone medic. If they don't or won't then kick them from the squad & get a teamplayer in that will, QED.

[Leo]

And if it is possible, why not make enemies bleed if they enter inside spawn area of a flag, that is not theirs.

No, because when you are taking a flag, you're gonna want to watch the spawn points and kill anyone that spawns right?

[IAJTHOMAS]

The issue where this happens at the flag you're trying to cap should be addressd by AAS 2, or at least from what I understand of how it will work.

[DirtyHarry88]

Get rid of the in-game scoreboard and things will massively improve.

[Batalla35]

Get rid of the in-game scoreboard and things will massively improve.[/QUOTE

yeah you are right

batalla35

[Topf]

I know I am a *****, but if some rifleman does not react at all after yelling for minutes, I usually shoot his back and grab the kit.

[MMad]

Get rid of the in-game scoreboard and things will massively improve.

What things, specifically?

[IAJTHOMAS]

I know I am a *****, but if some rifleman does not react at all after yelling for minutes, I usually shoot his back and grab the kit.

What if he's out of ammo bags?

[bosco_]

What if he's out of ammo bags?

He could at least respond with a "Negative"... or just say it in chat.

[kurtmax_0]

lol @ topf

I've gotten to the point where, if I don't see anyone I've played with before I just quit playing PR for the night and do something more productive.. like sleep.

[Topf]

What if he's out of ammo bags?

As I usually play medic, I revive him afterwards, of course
btw:
IT NEVER happened to me, that after I grabbed a kit no ammo bags were avaible. If he has no ammo, he can react by saying "negative" or "sorry" -> Otherwise I expect to have a non-teamplaying idiot infront of me that deserves to be killed.
Don`t worry, I usually yell 10 times or more until I reach this point