Completely Removing the map with friendly positions for infantry

[McBumLuv]

Well, I remember there being a thread on this, but through all my toils of searching, I wasn't able to locate it. There is a similar thread to it from pre 0.7, https://www.realitymod.com/forum/f18-pr ... eapon.html, but it was locked and I wish do discuss a suggestion that is similar, but not the same.

Firstly, Clypp has made some very nice topographical maps (https://www.realitymod.com/forum/f66-pr ... imaps.html), and AFAIK VoXiNaTiOn and Deltafart may be finishing the project.

Secondly, it's quite unrealistic for infantry especially to get magic up-to-the-second-live satellite maps revealing all of your team, as well as the direction that they are facing.

To these ends, I was hoping to make it so that Squad leaders could have a topographical map as a "weapon" with which he could see objectives, but can't see any infantry. All of the squad members would have to rely on the SL, as they would not have the maps.

This would not apply for vehicles, as they still have their mini maps simulating GPSs I guess.

I see many Pros with this inclusion:

• The need to use landmarks to know where you're going and not get lost.
• The need to correctly ID targets through their uniforms before firing.
• A heavier reliance of the commander to give friendly positions.
• Another advantage to having a commander, because of an all-revealing map.
• A more in-depth playing experience.
• An expanded hierarchy providing each higher level (SM, SL, Commander) with better tools to be situationally aware. (from no map, to topographical map, to satellite map with friendly positions).
• Makes the commander useful, as he can keep his job, but is the only one aware of all the battlefield intel. He can now be used to coordinate the squads properly, since they'll need to rely on him.

A few potential problems exist, however, including:

• How would infantry know where to attack/defend?
• Would require enough time-consuming work put into it.

That first problem can be dealt with by either having (if possible) the map "weapon" show the attack and defend icons on the map, but with the image changed to look more like it's been just "drawn" onto the map.

If that's not possible, then a commander could provide the intel, making his/her role so much more important.

But don't forget this problem isn't a "problem" on CnC game modes, either.


The last problem shouldn't be too much of a pain, though, because I think it would be all worth it in the end. What are your thoughts concerning this?

[Vege]

Just give me a map where i can see my own location and SL markers only and give SL a map where they can see other SLs aswell and im happy, but i guess this one is hardcoded?

[CodeRedFox]

All great ideas...reality of actually coming to light might be slim. But a hardcore version if ever an option, and must be an option would be great.

But unlike Vege I would say NO markers at all.

[Airsoft]

Officer, spec op, and sniper should get map.

[CodeRedFox]

Well I think a map but as a weapon static, Its just a map that move to your FOV. Like a map on paper and that's it.

But I agree Officer, tankers, pilots and sniper should be the only ones with these paper maps.

[killer911pt]

if you have played FarCry 2 i imagine the map would be similar to the map in that gmae

[Incomplete Spork]

Perhaps?
bf2 map idea - Xfire Video

[gclark03]

A possible map hierarchy:

SM: Static topographical map

SL: Static topographical map on foot, satellite map while in a vehicle (simulation of Blue Force Tracker and imitators, using same code as Commander map limitation)

Commander: Command Post only (same as current)

Also, that video is OK, but the map needs to be folded when the player selects it. When the player right-clicks, the soldier unfolds the map and puts it to his face, covering a good part of the screen. The only problem is animating paper, which is probably difficult.

[Vege]

Can't think another game where you look your map first to check if it's a friend or foe.
Never really liked mini map in vanilla and have never missed it in reality.
Only thing that i would like to know where other squads are as commander is not allways there and relying on him to know where other squads are would be too mutch.
Squad members should be around his leader so it should not be that big of a problem.

First think i noticed in PR was that people can run forewa and there is time delay on taking up your real map.

If you could not see anyting on the map it would make teamwork allot harder thus removing allot of things that are great in this mod.

[Jordanb716]

I think this is a great idea! But what would go where the map is now? nothing? Well in any case I say drop or replace the regular map for all units and give the special classes that need it like officer, sniper, and maybe pilots, and crewman the "weapon" maps although if its like all other weapons it might be a little hard to see if your in the shadows or something. Maybe have him pull out a flashlight along with it or something. Click to turn it on. gclark03s right click to unfold sounds good as well. (If all this can be implemented of course)

[Astromici]

Have squad leaders able to see the positions of their own squad and other squad leaders. Have squad members able to see their squad, have spec ops and commanders able to see everyone , snipers able to see squad leaders, and crewmans and pilots able to see squad leaders.

[CodeRedFox]

True with out SL to SL VOIP something needs to be in place Astromici

[gclark03]

Text

[McBumLuv]

Well I'm glad I've got such a good reception

As for "markers", if possible, I'd have them replaced but text as if it was written in on the map, if only so you're not confused about which flags to take. Almost like this:



Though we don't necessarily need that, even, if there is a commander. This would also portray their role as much more important, since only the commanders would actually know where to attack with what.

As to preventing friendly fire, asking a commander if there are friendlies in such and such area is easy, or in team-chat even. Plus, I find it quite easy to identify certain factions (though the PLA and Brit woodland camo seems similar at a distance).

[M_Striker]

I suggested this a while ago, and everyone hated this idea. Am I missing something?

The idea makes sense and is a really good one.

[McBumLuv]

I suggested this a while ago, and everyone hated this idea. Am I missing something?

The idea makes sense and is a really good one.

It may have been your thread, too. I was looking for it, since I had posted most of these thoughts in it, but couldn't find it after searching so I just started a new one. Besides, this allows more publicity on it, you should be proud

[badmojo420]

It almost seems counter-productive to remove the mini-map if we're all going to hit caps lock and check the big map every time we see a contact. I feel that infantry shouldn't get a map at all. The squad leaders get a map with only attack and defend flag/cache markings. Vehicle operators get maps with their locations. And commander gets the full map we have currently.

The way the game is setup into squads with commands coming down from above. There really isn't a need for the grunts to have a map of their own. They should be focused on fighting. If they see a contact, they report it to the squad, who checks it out, if its still unclear, the SL could report it to the commander and he would inform you of any friendlies in the area. It's such a small change but it would impact game play greatly. Reinforcing the team work aspect of PR that we love so much.

I would keep the whole map when you are dead, so you can see where to spawn and what the rest of the team is up to. And as much as i would like to see them go, the attack markers would make up for any loss of direction with removing the map. I could even understand removing the compass unless you're in a vehicle, but then i would also like to see friendly names removed. But those things are never going to happen. I'm just hoping this one does.

[Tannhauser]

I strongly support the removal of active blues on the M-Map for everyone on the battlefield EXCEPT the commander.

The commander intended job has been said to be coordination? Well now, that'd make him VERY important. But really, VERY VERY important for the tteam won't be able to know who goes where, does what, and where are friendlies and ennemies.
I'd love it as commander, and as SL too, because I'd really talk to my commander a LOT MORE.

Removing the map itself is unnecessary, however, removing moving-blues and only being able to see moving-greens and commander/SL-icons would finalize the step intended when the Garmin was removed from infantrymen. If anything, that is the BEST solution to make the Commander useful and the game, by far more realistic.

If only that was possible for the upcoming release, then i'd be the happiest man on this earth believe me.

[badmojo420]

I think someone(maybe a dev) said it was not possible to show icons depending on type. So you could either show all vehicles or none, all players or none, etc. I believe they can only edit the icons to be invisible. So i don't know how they would show SLs but not squads. Vehicles driven by SLs, rather then normal blues. And other problems like that. I might be wrong about this. But it was discussed before.

I think they should just remove every friendly player & vehicle icon from regular soldiers on foot. Keep the map, and flags. SLs can set a marker or give a grid. Medics would be an exception, maybe just keep the wounded icons.

[cyberzomby]

hmmm. This would be better for realism but would increase the hard-core level so much more! Remember all the shouting and stuff going on when they wanted to remove the mini-map onscreen? This will be such a thing as well.

What happens when your cut uff with your SL. Or when you spawn in later because you just joined? You got to wait for your SL.

In real life soldiers get to look at a map area for a lot of time to memorise the area before going in. We dont do that here. Thats why at least everyone needs a map.

Im not a huge fan of removing the icons as well. Remember not everyone has the best equipment to play PR. So those players will TK a lot more increasing irritation amongst there team killed players and themselves.

Dont forget that this is still somewhat of a game. For true realism go ARMA or OFP2 when its released.