Use the machineguns, people, the machineguns! Brief guide to machineguns inside

Post by **IronTaxi** » 2007-06-23 03:12

agreed fishowrk...i love the support kit but unfortunately it does not has the desired suppresion effect that it supposed to produce so people continue to pop up and one shot me...which is fing ridiculous cause in reality you would be dropping a load in your pants...not sticking your head out...

i dont know how to make it more effective aside from giving it perhaps better accuracy and/or increased rate of fire...it should be extremely scarey to come up against given that it is a fairly limited kit..

TBH though the biggest weakness for the support kit is the poor BF2 hitbox detection... i can put 50 bullets in a guy and it may or may not hit/kill him which is insane...(mind you i never ping lower than 200 in europ and US servers so that says alot...)

i thik just going from crouch to standing should cause a huge deviation for a second or 2...none of this pop and duck shooting...drives me insane...(guys dont do it in game either its gay.)

Fishw0rk wrote:Unfortunately I think it's going to get worse for the LMGers in .6 and .7 unless some changes are made. In .6 the LMG is simply out-classed on maps with longer view distance due to the new scopes for riflemen and officers. In .7 Grenadiers will also get scopes.

There are alot of things that I think need to be changed for the support kit to be played more often. I VERY MUCH want to see more blur effects when someone has a support kit shooting at them. One of the biggest annoyances I have right now is people popping up in my line of fire at a distance and continuing to take pot shots at me. There's no way of really making them scared of the LMG. I dont think BF2 supports a feature for affecting their accuracy while under fire, so I'd rather see looootttssss of blur.

Another issue is that people can sprint too fast as well as take too many shots while sprinting at full speed. I'd really like to see some kind of stun feature added so that a person slows down when shot (or their stamina bar is depleted when shot). That would help the LMGs, as well as all kits, out immensly.

Apheirox · Post by **Apheirox** » 2007-06-23 03:29

I agree, scopes are needed. Maybe they should be optional.

Hx.Clavdivs · Post by **Hx.Clavdivs** » 2007-06-23 03:48

About 8 years back online on a very different "realism" mod, a whole team opened fire towards the same objective and demolished the enemy. One on the opposite side said on chat: "WTF was that?"

Suppressive fire. By 15 online "soldiers". Thats was the WTF.

[uBp]Irish · Post by **[uBp]Irish** » 2007-06-23 04:22

good job.. now there is not hope of me getting my saw anymore...

Flanker15 · Post by **Flanker15** » 2007-06-23 04:44

I use the SAW but I get killed very quickly if I try to suppress enemies with it. It's like this: you see the enemy squad and decide to lay down suppression fire so your squad can move in a hit them. You start shooting and maybe hit one or two with your poor accuracy, then one of their riflemen just stops, aims at you and shoots you in the head. Since you can't move and have to use prone (no cover set up) as soon as you start shooting you're a bullet magnet with all your noise and tracers. The enemy squad doesn't suppress (obviously because they're people and don't care about getting killed) and one of them just shoots you, the end.

sekiryu · Post by **sekiryu** » 2007-06-23 04:56

Last time I played the .6 beta, I grabbed the SAW as often as I could. It was the only way I could kill anyone, lol.

Post by **IronTaxi** » 2007-06-23 07:27

exactly flanker...midn you...

the saw gunner should be back and covering a wide area and not be the lead element in the squad..i think that is probably a common mistake for support gunners...

it helps increase you life expectancy...

i remember reading somewhere that in RL the avergae life expectancy of and RPG gunner is like 5minutes after having fired a round due the huge exposrue that they put on themselves...so i guess maybe things are not too unrealistic

Flanker15 wrote:I use the SAW but I get killed very quickly if I try to suppress enemies with it. It's like this: you see the enemy squad and decide to lay down suppression fire so your squad can move in a hit them. You start shooting and maybe hit one or two with your poor accuracy, then one of their riflemen just stops, aims at you and shoots you in the head. Since you can't move and have to use prone (no cover set up) as soon as you start shooting you're a bullet magnet with all your noise and tracers. The enemy squad doesn't suppress (obviously because they're people and don't care about getting killed) and one of them just shoots you, the end.

VipersGhost · Post by **VipersGhost** » 2007-06-23 08:14

Its interesting issue here. We are facing a new battlefield situation where nearly every player has a scoped-accurate rifle. I don't think this is how the battlefield IRL functions as the current % of scoped weapons is probably incredibly inaccurate...the SAW is not used for these long ranged engagements and of course is grossly outclassed/useless in them. A SAW vs AK47 is of course in the SAW's favor as their killing ranges are similar but the SAW delivers more lead in similar accuracy. It seems like there are just too many scopes out there to deliver RL battle scenarios...especially with instant aim etc...its really really giving the advantage to anyone with a scoped rifle. Maybe this is fine but it does reduce the need for SAW type weapons greatly as they just aren't as effective unless you use them in CQB style play. Not to say there aren't guys kicking *** with them from time to time...the "player" definitely plays more of a role in how many kills you get vs the gun you have. I still think that the number of scopes available will probably need to be re-evaluated but who knows...maybe its fine.

Desertfox · Post by **Desertfox** » 2007-06-23 08:22

VipersGhost wrote:Its interesting issue here. We are facing a new battlefield situation where nearly every player has a scoped-accurate rifle. I don't think this is how the battlefield IRL functions as the current % of scoped weapons is probably incredibly inaccurate...the SAW is not used for these long ranged engagements and of course is grossly outclassed/useless in them. A SAW vs AK47 is of course in the SAW's favor as their killing ranges are similar but the SAW delivers more lead in similar accuracy. It seems like there are just too many scopes out there to deliver RL battle scenarios...especially with instant aim etc...its really really giving the advantage to anyone with a scoped rifle. Maybe this is fine but it does reduce the need for SAW type weapons greatly as they just aren't as effective unless you use them in CQB style play. Not to say there aren't guys kicking *** with them from time to time...the "player" definitely plays more of a role in how many kills you get vs the gun you have. I still think that the number of scopes available will probably need to be re-evaluated but who knows...maybe its fine.

Not sure about the US, but I know that susat's are standard issue for British and elcan's are standard issue for Canadians.

Mr.Nicklebe · Post by **Mr.Nicklebe** » 2007-06-23 11:20

I find it funny how i get in the region of 5 times as many kills with a saw gun than a rifle, yet no one else ever uses the kit. Its good in a way because its always there for me the select.

The SAW and PKM are great, not so sure on the PLA MG seems to have less ammo.

Only issue is everyone and everyone will know where the support gunner is because of the tracer and incredibly loud noise you make

Post by **Bob_Marley** » 2007-06-23 11:30

Mr.Nicklebe wrote:I find it funny how i get in the region of 5 times as many kills with a saw gun than a rifle, yet no one else ever uses the kit. Its good in a way because its always there for me the select.

The SAW and PKM are great, not so sure on the PLA MG seems to have less ammo.

Only issue is everyone and everyone will know where the support gunner is because of the tracer and incredibly loud noise you make

Total round count is being evened up in 0.6, IIRC.

Minimi/M249 = 200 rounds per box

HK21/PKM = 100 rounds per box

QBB-97 = 75 rounds per drum, IIRC. Might be 80.

Anyway, in 0.6 all support gunners for the regular armies will carry 600 rounds.

ZaZZo · Post by **ZaZZo** » 2007-06-23 11:53

Bob loves WWII guns.

EDIT: Replyed to the wrong post lol

M4nicMin3r · Post by **M4nicMin3r** » 2007-06-23 13:12

I remember having a funny mo on metsia last night. We were defending the perimiter1 flag i was hiddy away in some rocks with rifleman kit just to the north east, the enemy kept streaming to the flag (right past me so i shot em in the back

) and another guy in my squad had the support kit to the south and was just constantly hammering away at the flag.

Not only did it sound awesome but many kills got racked up and the supression worked 100% , the enemy stayed squat from the support gun.., right infront of me as they were too occupied with dodgeing the hail of fire coming from the south, and i picked them all off from their rear flank .., well most of them as the others that popped up to try to neutralise the support guy just got bullets in the head.

El_Vikingo · Post by **El_Vikingo** » 2007-06-23 14:32

You guys are going to love the next build.

Maverick--113 · Post by **Maverick--113** » 2007-06-23 14:51

El_Vikingo wrote:You guys are going to love the next build.

Please elaborate!

Apheirox · Post by **Apheirox** » 2007-06-23 14:51

Sweet! 'Next build' - Are you talking about 0.6 or 0.7?

Post by **Bob_Marley** » 2007-06-23 16:47

I'm guessing that by "next build" he's talking about v0.606, the current tester build. Should be going public beta some time today.

eddie · Post by **eddie** » 2007-06-23 19:05

I've already got it

And no, I'm not a tester.